question about layering vocals and compression

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question about layering vocals and compression

Postby mistersully » Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:45 am

Hi Guys

Quick question

When layering vocals, do you guys generally use the same mic and compressor/settings for each part when tracking?

I'm specifically talking about doubling parts etc, rather than adding harmonies.

Cheers
Dave Graham

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Re: question about layering vocals and compression

Postby Ben M » Thu Jul 25, 2013 9:09 am

Yes generally I use the same everything when doubling because it's what the singer is used to singing with and the double is mostly tracked directly after the main vox so they are in the pocket with it. I don't want the singer to change what they're doing. If anything I'll use a little more HPFing on the double so it doesn't get to boggy with the main.
In the mix they're treated differently with different colours and spaces depending on the type of song.

mistersully wrote:Hi Guys

Quick question

When layering vocals, do you guys generally use the same mic and compressor/settings for each part when tracking?

I'm specifically talking about doubling parts etc, rather than adding harmonies.

Cheers
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Re: question about layering vocals and compression

Postby Ben M » Thu Jul 25, 2013 9:09 am

...
Last edited by Ben M on Thu Jul 25, 2013 9:11 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: question about layering vocals and compression

Postby Ben M » Thu Jul 25, 2013 9:09 am

haha I just doubled my post :) whoops
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Re: question about layering vocals and compression

Postby Chris H » Thu Jul 25, 2013 10:12 am

I use the same gear except I like to get the singer to sing a few inches further from the mic on the 2nd layer and I adjust the compressor accordingly.
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Re: question about layering vocals and compression

Postby waitup » Thu Jul 25, 2013 10:15 am

I'd love to change mics/compressors for the double... but man... who's got time!
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Re: question about layering vocals and compression

Postby Chinagraf » Thu Jul 25, 2013 2:56 pm

I do like Chris H does, but I get them to take a half step back with each pair of doubles, and I adjust the gain on the pre rather than the compressor. That and sometime the last layer I ask them to sing like a Pirate, :ar!
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Re: question about layering vocals and compression

Postby Ben M » Thu Jul 25, 2013 7:39 pm

There really should be more pirate gang vocals in today's music. I don't know what the young bands of today are thinking with their sweet melodies and stuff ??*&#
Aye did some pirate gangs recently for a radio play and I laughed my ass off for hours.
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Re: question about layering vocals and compression

Postby gigpiglet » Fri Jul 26, 2013 12:46 am

yes same chain for me.
but often in mixing i EQ differently (and often De-ess hard on the double)
i also edit the doubles pretty hard - taking out anything that strays at all - always chopping breaths, consinents, plosives, and esses out of the doubles so that they are only heard once (or volume automating them down)
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Re: question about layering vocals and compression

Postby mistersully » Fri Jul 26, 2013 8:17 am

Thanks all.

Pirates huh? I'll stock up on rum and parrots for atmosphere.
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Re: question about layering vocals and compression

Postby Paul Maybury » Fri Jul 26, 2013 12:43 pm

+1 what Gareth said.
I'll often filter out heaps of bottom and top on the double during mixing. More editing to avoid drawing attention to it as well.
Unless I'm going for a real '60's kind of thing. Then the double will sound the same and I wont be trying to get the two lines that tight with each other. Have you heard the doubling on early Kinks stuff? It almost sounds like Ray isn't even singing the same song!
Vari speed is handy too. Why don't all DAW's feature this? Reaper is only one I know of. When I want to do this in Logic, I clock my converters from an old Sony digital 8 track and use the vari speed on that. Crude, but it works.
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Re: question about layering vocals and compression

Postby Chris H » Fri Jul 26, 2013 1:22 pm

Paul Maybury wrote:+1 what Gareth said.
I'll often filter out heaps of bottom and top on the double during mixing. More editing to avoid drawing attention to it as well.
Unless I'm going for a real '60's kind of thing. Then the double will sound the same and I wont be trying to get the two lines that tight with each other. Have you heard the doubling on early Kinks stuff? It almost sounds like Ray isn't even singing the same song!
Vari speed is handy too. Why don't all DAW's feature this? Reaper is only one I know of. When I want to do this in Logic, I clock my converters from an old Sony digital 8 track and use the vari speed on that. Crude, but it works.
Cheers,
Paul

There is a simpler way to access varispeed in Logic:
In the arrange page select View > Customise Transport Bar click the Varispeed option.

Customise Transport.tiff


The Varispeed button then shows up on the transport:

Transport With Varispeed.tiff
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
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Re: question about layering vocals and compression

Postby Paul Maybury » Fri Jul 26, 2013 4:36 pm

Hi Chris, thanks for that, I had no idea. Can't believe it!
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Re: question about layering vocals and compression

Postby Chris H » Fri Jul 26, 2013 5:32 pm

That's the trouble with Logic....it's all there but finding where it is hidden is the challenge. Hover the cursur over the "speed only" lettering the varispeed options menu bar pops up. I pick the brains of every other Logic user I work with so i can acces things i have no idea about or find other ways of doing things to enhance workflow. There is usually several ways of doing the same thing in Logic, and depending on how you work and navigate, each Logic user seems to develop thair own unique approach to the app. Some psychologist should write a thesis obout it..........
Personality profiles determined by the Individuals use of Logic Audio
Logic to a Keyboard Player is a totaly different app to Logic for a guitarist
There is the Anal Retentive modus operandi
Logic for the Obsessive Compulsive
the dope smokers dissarange page
the speed freaks key command set and how to use Logic without ever aproaching the menu bar
The technocrats Object Layer approach

Then there is a new approach to Logic starting to impact the user base called.....
Stuff Logic, and Profools can go to hell! I'm switching to Reaper!
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Re: question about layering vocals and compression

Postby Hookemeister » Sat Jul 27, 2013 9:30 pm

Stuff Logic, and Profools can go to hell! I'm switching to Reaper!


Well you won't regret that sensible decision.
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Re: question about layering vocals and compression

Postby NYMo » Sun Jul 28, 2013 11:53 am

Also leave the plosives out of the overdub and SSS too.
( especially on the first syllable of each phrase)
Original Thanks... Overdub. Anks etc

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Re: question about layering vocals and compression

Postby rick » Mon Jul 29, 2013 12:04 am

if its the same singer I always change the mic , or if thats hard to change for workflow reasons i get the singer to quickly change the mic pattern .

The last thing I want to try and mix is 6 versions of the same room sound hung on top of each other
it just starts fighting the main vocal instead of blending
old trick is your best mic for main vocals your shitty ones for backing tracks

compression is always set for the noise coming into it.
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Re: question about layering vocals and compression

Postby gigpiglet » Mon Jul 29, 2013 11:32 am

interesting interesting interesting...
since i start vocal tracking on jacks record today...
i might be trying your "trick" rick.

you have to master it - so its your fault if it doesnt work and you have to "fix it in mastering" right?

;-)
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Re: question about layering vocals and compression

Postby Drumstruck » Mon Jul 29, 2013 12:01 pm

that album's becoming a regular little t/rock family affair Gareth :-)
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Re: question about layering vocals and compression

Postby rick » Mon Jul 29, 2013 12:33 pm

I will take the punt gareth :)

changing the mics an incredibly common vocal recording method
.. or at least it is in the world I have always breathed in.

I nearly didn't bother to post it because I figure we all did that ?

but nothing like learning something new each day

today I learnt is best not to leave your bag of shopping on the seat in the shops and walk off.

you would think I would know that one by now !


onwards and upwards
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