Turtlerock Forum

I've been using Nuendo for a long time now. It wasn't mine though and I can't afford it... so I got Pro Tools.

Oh my gosh Pro Tools sux! How hard is it to do everything compared to Nuendo?! And so far it appears Pro Tools can't do what Nuendo can do. I guess that's why it's worth so much more.

Sorry, just venting some of my utter disappointment.

Are you using PT LE or HD?

It would probably be unfair to compare Nuendo to PT LE, as Nuendo is Steinberg's high end post production/studio sequencer. Perhaps you should have bought Cubase instead, which is very similar to Nuendo and not too much more expensive than PT LE.

I use both PT LE and Cubase SX3 at home, and PT HD at work. I prefer MIDI work in Cubase, and audio in PT. Editing in PT is 100 times better. Mixing I prefer in PT too. For composing and initial writing I prefer Cubase.

I might buy Logic and check it out, seeing as it is so cheap these days. Might be the middle ground.

Jason Dirckze wrote:Are you using PT LE or HD?

It would probably be unfair to compare Nuendo to PT LE, as Nuendo is Steinberg's high end post production/studio sequencer. Perhaps you should have bought Cubase instead, which is very similar to Nuendo and not too much more expensive than PT LE.

I use both PT LE and Cubase SX3 at home, and PT HD at work. I prefer MIDI work in Cubase, and audio in PT. Editing in PT is 100 times better. Mixing I prefer in PT too. For composing and initial writing I prefer Cubase.

I might buy Logic and check it out, seeing as it is so cheap these days. Might be the middle ground.

I must say that I also do the same - I work in PT LE (home/project studio) and Cubase SX3. The midi editing in Cubase is far superior to PT, but for audio and mixing, PT is much better.
I'm finishing my Digidesign certification in PT at the moment, and the more you learn, the more friendly PT is. However, I was a Steinberg Pro24 user way back in the late 80's, then migrated to Cubase after that.
I still use Cubase as I can do things very quickly still which would take me longer in PT..
Tim..

Yeah I'm talking about Nuendo 3 to PT LE. It probably just takes a bit of getting used to I guess.

ProTools is great for recording and editing, it is reliable, stable and straightforward, but I find Nuendo is a much better compositional tool, and it feels more musical to me. Different horses for different courses.

Sounds like you must be a bit of an expert at Pro Tools, Tim. Do you (or anyone else) know if you can organise your plug in lists like you can in Nuendo? i.e. take a few unused plug ins out (to make it easier to find the ones your after)??

I normally use Pro Tools LE or HD although I have been doing some work with Nuendo with clients. Still cannot get the hang of tight editing in Nuendo although been using Pro Tools now for a long time. So for me its the oposite he he
If your happy with Nuendo then buy Cubase if $'s worry you. Or try Logic.
Depending what version of Pro Tools you have I am pretty sure you can organise plugins now. Check through the reference guide and look on [url]duc.digidesign.com[/url]

Same here, I've been using PT HD3 ever since it came out and a Mix system before that. I'm using Logic 8 and I dig it, but find it a bit everywhere when it comes to mixing in Logic and prefer PT HD. Recording with Logic and the Apogee Ensemble is a treat especially for location work and song writing.

nIC

Take a english speaking person, never been out of their country, pick them up and drop them in the middle foreign country, everything is going to suck on that first day, cant speak a word of the new language, cant order some food, ask directions, just try opening a bank account.

fast forward a few weeks things are looking a little better, a year forward and things are coming together, 5 years and you are fluent.

either that or you just cant find a way to get on and you do whatever to get back to what you know as a better place.

Roy wrote:Sounds like you must be a bit of an expert at Pro Tools, Tim. Do you (or anyone else) know if you can organise your plug in lists like you can in Nuendo? i.e. take a few unused plug ins out (to make it easier to find the ones your after)??

Roy,
I wouldn't say I'm an expert by a long shot - an expert is a drip under pressure I just want to master PT as best I can.
To answer your question about moving plugins, move the ones you don't want to use to the
Program Files/Common Files/Digidesign/DAE/Plug-Ins (Unused) folder - you can move them back and forth if need be (you need to do a PT restart tho)
I'm not sure of the folder for Mac, but I'm sure it would be similar (I'm a Windows user here)..
Hope this helps.
T..

That's brilliant Tim! Thanks for that info. Exactly what I was looking for!

Well I've had Pro Tools LE for about a month now and I still regret get it. What a piece of s#%t!!!! Here are the only things (in my opinion) it beats Nuendo on... Grouping and Colourful appearance. But then who gives a crap about any of that!

Someone correct me but the keyboard shortcuts can't be modified, everything seems to be a '2 key command' (seemingly always requiring 'ctrl' or 'alt' plus some other key. It seems there's always a need to change tools to edit tracks in one way or another. You can't turn input monitoring off. Anything you want to modify with the session will take generally 3 clicks of the mouse or 2 to 3 keys on the keyboard. It takes forever to start, even with my 4 gig dual core processer super computer. And here's the biggest thing- I can't get rid of this "Access Violation' error. I downloaded a supposed fix for it off the Digidesign website but it hasn't seemed to achieve anything! Grrrr! I shouldn't complain. You get what you pay for, don't you??? If I bought a box filled with someone's s#%t inside it... I'd call it a 003R.

Sorry if this offends anyone passionate about Pro Tools. You probably had much better luck than myself.

I'm on the edge. Can anyone help with these Pro Tools LE issues I have????

As a Nuendo user I totally agree, however that dosent mean that if you are determined to be a Pro Tools guy that, given time, you will eventually get used to it.

Imagine my pain as I daily have the jump around between Nuendo, Pro tools, and sometimes Logic, at least I have all my key commands customized in nuendo and logic to be the same.

Here is a possible solution for you: get a contour shuttle pro, set it up the way you like, then set it up for both pro tools and nuendo.

that way your play key is always play, your zoom/scroll keys, edit keys are always the same no mater what program you are in.

Roy wrote:Well I've had Pro Tools LE for about a month now and I still regret get it. What a piece of s#%t!!!! Here are the only things (in my opinion) it beats Nuendo on... Grouping and Colourful appearance. But then who gives a crap about any of that!

Someone correct me but the keyboard shortcuts can't be modified, everything seems to be a '2 key command' (seemingly always requiring 'ctrl' or 'alt' plus some other key. It seems there's always a need to change tools to edit tracks in one way or another. You can't turn input monitoring off. Anything you want to modify with the session will take generally 3 clicks of the mouse or 2 to 3 keys on the keyboard. It takes forever to start, even with my 4 gig dual core processer super computer. And here's the biggest thing- I can't get rid of this "Access Violation' error. I downloaded a supposed fix for it off the Digidesign website but it hasn't seemed to achieve anything! Grrrr! I shouldn't complain. You get what you pay for, don't you??? If I bought a box filled with someone's s#%t inside it... I'd call it a 003R.

Sorry if this offends anyone passionate about Pro Tools. You probably had much better luck than myself.

I'm on the edge. Can anyone help with these Pro Tools LE issues I have????

Roy, I don't want to sound like a smart-alec, but maybe a little more Reference Manual reading could be helpful. There's a whole host of editing functions that can be performed with one key, you need to be in 'command keyboard focus' mode to do it. If you're going to spend much time on PT it really pays to memorise these one-key shortcuts. Even 'undo' is just 'z' instead of 'control-z'.
As for needing to change tools for editing, you can select the 'smart' tool which changes from Selector to Grabber to Fades to Trimmer depending on where in the region the tool is.
What do you mean by 'input monitoring' - Auto Input or Input only? Quite different things and can be toggled using Alt+K (2 keys I know...)
It can take a while to start up, especially if you've to a full suite of Waves plugins, but with only the stock plugins it's not that bad. And you only need to do it once a day, surely? Otherwise think of it as 'tape rewinding' quiet time...
Can't help you with the access violation error but running PT on a PC is always abit risky if you haven't made sure all your hardware is listed as 'compatible' by Digidesign (not saying that you didn't!). I've got two stable PT systems on pc, not on 7.4 yet so maybe it's still a bit buggy.
Maybe you should check out the Digidesign user forum, it can be useful for sorting out problems and learing useful stuff.

Hi Roy

as to whether PT is crap is in the eye of the user. i know all my keystrokes, and i work fast. put me on Cubase or (il)Logic and i could maybe route and arm a track, but beyond that . . .

you like all the purdy new colours in PT? to my mind they kind'a detract from the point of PT - i loved that it was sooo visually basic.
less pretty colour distractions = less time spent screwing around = more productivity.

so you've got the disable plug-in issue sorted. check.

you're learning the shortcuts? it is the only way to make PT work properly for ya. well, an automated control surface would help . . .

access violation - more information, please. when does this occur? what were you doing (starting PT - loading a particular plugin, or setting up DAE? or setting up midi? or were you working in session?) i have had similar occasionally (once resulting in me having to do a total system rebuild) but it is always due to me being a nerdy smartarse.
that said, my PT installation (7.1) is incredibly stable for a windoze system. but i restrict the plugins to just the essentials, in order to maintain an outboard/hardware focus and push me to commit sounds at tracking stage.

I believe in using PT as a tape-deck. i do drop-ins, fades, basic edits and midi, but i try to keep it simple. real simple. the best software for you will depend on what you're trying to achieve, and how you like to work.

bon appetite!

chris
mfdu

mfdu wrote:Hi Roy

as to whether PT is crap is in the eye of the user. i know all my keystrokes, and i work fast. put me on Cubase or (il)Logic and i could maybe route and arm a track, but beyond that . . .

you like all the purdy new colours in PT? to my mind they kind'a detract from the point of PT - i loved that it was sooo visually basic.
less pretty colour distractions = less time spent screwing around = more productivity.

so you've got the disable plug-in issue sorted. check.

you're learning the shortcuts? it is the only way to make PT work properly for ya. well, an automated control surface would help . . .

access violation - more information, please. when does this occur? what were you doing (starting PT - loading a particular plugin, or setting up DAE? or setting up midi? or were you working in session?) i have had similar occasionally (once resulting in me having to do a total system rebuild) but it is always due to me being a nerdy smartarse.
that said, my PT installation (7.1) is incredibly stable for a windoze system. but i restrict the plugins to just the essentials, in order to maintain an outboard/hardware focus and push me to commit sounds at tracking stage.

I believe in using PT as a tape-deck. i do drop-ins, fades, basic edits and midi, but i try to keep it simple. real simple. the best software for you will depend on what you're trying to achieve, and how you like to work.

bon appetite!

chris
mfdu

Good points Chris - I agree with what you say.
Keep it simple prinicple.. Only use the plugins that you need regularly and know well. Then there's no time-wasting
Tim..