Turtlerock Forum

Hi All,

I'm in NYC for a few days presenting a avante/contemporary dance show but I've got a few days spare and would love to cruise a few second hand music equipment shops. Does anybody have any good leads or suggestions?


M

There's a great shop in Bleeker St in Greenwich Village http://www.umanovguitars.com/index.html

There's also a few around Mannys on 48th just off Broadway.

Might be best just to check the Yellow Pages for s/h shops if you are looking for real bargains.

Myles - don't be tempted!!!!!!

Thanks chris but I'd really like a u87 or u89 pair and the dollar is so strong at the moment...

M

I tell you something - U89's are the most underrated Neumann's ( The older ones ) -So Cheap and they take EQ like nothing else. A secret weapon for me!
Good shopping list!

Neumann U89, great on toms

Neumann U67, even better on toms

I had a quartet of u89's when I worked at the sound research studio and used them all the time. Can't understand why there isn't more demand. In fact I'll stop writing now because guntsluts will now jack the price by 500% with stupid statements of "warmer but fatter... or so I've heard but I haven't used them myself" rubbish. They work I like the sound and to be honest that could be said of quite a lot of different mics depending on circumstance. I also have a pair of c414EB with the original c12 capsule. They rock in the right situation and dont in others as do my gefell m692's, my km85's, my oktava mc012, beyer's, uher's etc etc. For the work I do I miss the u89's more and more but only in the situations I liked them... Also want a langevin dvc, another dbx 160 to pair with the one I've already got and anything else ridiculously priced....

M

Myles

I'm in NY next april and would appreciate some info on some of the back alley secondhand gear shops you find.
I've just finished reading Bob dylan's Chronicles vol. 1 which has kept my juices flowing.

My feet just got itchier.

Yes the U89's are killer - If you need the valve texture put a valve pre or comp in the chain. Ive been using a U89 on lead vocals on Mr D.Johns (and I have 2 wagners - so I'm rediculously fussy)
But a u67 on toms is stupidly expensive - 6k for a tom mic? - forget it! use a Cad M179 for $200 - or a Mc012 or a 421 or a 451 but not a $6k mic - its like saying a 20k Telefunkin is great on toms - sure it is - so is a RCA 44 !

I've quite qood selection of neat valve pres and some sweet vintage discrete solid state ones. Same goes for mics but a u89 is the top of my list. and u67 as a tom mic? if that comes from the john bonham mic setup the number one thing to remember is that the drm sound is not the mics, not the desk but the bleed into the other mics in the same room and a clever engineer with excellent taste and character compressors. Best quote I've seen in a long time? "Great sound man... what are you using on that(insert instrument here)? ..... "oh, um that?.... Thirty years experience..." brilliant even though I haven't got thirty years experience yet.


On a further not I prefer fast, clean responsive mics (solid state) hitting smooth, warm, colourful (valve or transformer based) pres/compressors/eqs. But thats me and I've never had a hit ot even close. Lots of superb repeat clients and collaborators though... perhaps if I reverse that I'll get that hit? nah, its never about the gear, though it helps.

looking forward to december chris!

M

The Tasmanian wrote:But a u67 on toms is stupidly expensive - 6k for a tom mic? - forget it! use a Cad M179 for $200 - or a Mc012 or a 421 or a 451 but not a $6k mic - its like saying a 20k Telefunkin is great on toms - sure it is - so is a RCA 44 !

ha.. I thought that might get a rise. But yeah it would seem ridiculous now ..but then...67's weren't overly sort after. In the early 90's they weren't worth as much. Although forever desired.
I baby my 87's and wouldn't have them near drum heads.

The 67's just made beautiful tom sounds. I had to do it!!!

BTW no mics were hurt in those recordings.

i have made a number of records using u47s as tom mics whats wrong with that ?
i am planning on getting my wayback machine fixed and going back in time and nicking them so i can do it again some day

but i have been collecting neumann um57 for the job for some time
did you say you can get a good tom mic for $200 chris ...?
i could never manage to do that.... mics are either expensive of free for me
i cant figure spending $200 on a mic i would feel dirty .

my mate steve will sell his u89 for $1600 to the first person that wants it , nothing wrong with it

he hates it... i concur -
he just cannot bring himself to sell it on evil bay

Well I reckon If you can't get a great tom sound with the mic's i mentioned then you need more practice - sure put a vintage 47 on it - its so easy!
Someone snap up that U89 - and again if you can't get a great sound from a U89 and the right preamp / EQ on most things then I think you need to go back to school and learn the art of trying.
I believe in getting a mic and pushing your talents, experience, knowledge and the source into greatness - but thats me - others just stick the most expensive mic on anything and say that was so easy, I might have a cuppa tea now.
Some of the greatest engineers get the best guitar amp sound from a SM57 - Sure put a 67 on it - know what i'm sayin?

know what i'm saying ?

nah i have no idea chris
i tried to make a record with sm57s and a Ta@#$% desk once at damien gerard in about 1990
i wasnt good enough to do it !
it sounded shit no matter how hard i worked my bag of tricks ..f@#$ looking and sounding like i dont know what i am doing!

so i ran back to the saftey of the real pro gear i learnt on and i have stayed there ever since

the really good stuff drives the boat for you , all you have to do then is know when to throw out and pull up the anchor
you can spend you time listening to the song and keeping the bait on and the mud off the hooks .

if you cant make a great sounding record on vintage neumann mics
THEN its really time to reconsider your vocation !

The Tasmanian wrote:W
Some of the greatest engineers get the best guitar amp sound from a SM57 - Sure put a 67 on it - know what i'm sayin?

nah still not getting it ... u67 on a guitar amp ...crazy talk
i wouldnt use a u67by choice on anything
i have sold every one i ever had ( 7 of them )

but i do use fet u47s on guitar amps ...actually thats what i always start with

A great place to shop for some outrageous clothes (not designer) is "Trash and Vaudville" down in Greenwich Village. You want to look like Kieth Richards does in Pirates of the Caribbean or any other "Rockstar" look, they've got the stuff off the rack. An amazing place to visit.http://www.nycgoth.com/shops/trashnvaudeville/
and then you're not far from McSorley's Old Ale House http://www.mcsorleysnewyork.com/ The Oldest continually licenced bar in New York, a place that's seen Abe Lincoln, John Lennon, Woody Guthrie come through the doors. Sawdust on the floor, pot Belly Stove for heating. They serve Beer(dark or light), Cheese and Raw onions with a pack of crackers. The walls are papered with Newspaper clippings from the last 150 years(all original)- a real step back in time
There are some interesting second hand audio gear shops down around 34th street I came across, near the empire state/ Flatiron area , places where you could see stuff piled up everywhere and you had to ring the bell for someone to open the door, A bit like Waltham Dan's in Oxford st for those old enough to remember Mr Metz.
And of couse the string of Music shops on 48th St near Manny's. Where else could you see the latest SSL desk on the shop floor but New York.
Good Luck Myles, enjoy the project , hope you find some bargains.

I will always be open to getting results from a mixed bag of stuff - pro and not so pro gear. Mics are like guitars to me - I don't make my clients go and hire expensive 50's Strats or the like - great results happen from old shitbox danelectro's,silvertones, guilds,teisco's,old parlor acoustic guitars - all sorts of stuff that were cheap shit in their day.
Music is art at the end of the day - we as producers paint with sound - some engineers would never consider anything but high gloss paint for everything - for me its a blend of many textures, colours, qualities etc etc.
Each to their own i say - back to my reality I go!
Is that U89 for sale the older model?
If it is I do know someone who will great results with his killer pre's and great set of ears, and lack of 10k budget - let me know - great price for a shit mic.

Chris I was just messing with you of coarse you are right
it was late
I have a bunch of dubiously priced but great sounding stuff as well as the classics
but I do know what I like and quite often it isn't in line with everybody else

mastering is what I have always been known to be successful for
but I have enginneered on some pretty big albums in my time as well
I don't get platnuim records for engineering every day but I got em on the wall
at somepoint in the last couple of decades so I reckon you go with what you know

that u 89 is silver at its least as old as mid. Eighties
I will see Steve today and tell him I have somehow managed to talk it up by running it down
for those that don't know the u 89 has a smaller capsule then an 87/67/47
and was made as a c414 killer .....which is another mic I will never keep again unless it's free
I hate to think how many times I have had used and sold 414s
too many I hate them as well !
but the answer is lots and for the same reason as 89 mic
I always have to eq them heaps to make them work in a track at mix time
some guys like to work that hard
I like to know where I am going with a sound when I record it

back on topic
I wish I was in newyork hunting down some old gear shops
can you imagine a shop with old audio gear in it with the Aussie dollar as high as it istoday

Oh yeah Chris back off topic
I voted for you in the aria awards this year
fingers crossed

neumanns sound awesome on toms.

ffs!

got phil to stick one on 5 toms for our album....sexy times.

Oh Rick - that must be the first vote I've ever had for an Aria - maybe the last too!
I bet you my U89 I don't win an Aria.

I better not take the bet Chris
the voting school is small but I never seem to back
the right dog
I don't make my decisions on sales or who I worked for
maybe I should change my methods:)
you knew you were nominated though ?

I had no idea - nominated for what? - arguing on Trock?
I've always felt like a bit of an outsider as far as the Arias are concerned....

Don't worry about feeling like an outsider I am in with the in crowd
and I certainly feel like an outsider !
it's like the guys that actually make the records are invisible to them
I went to the very first arias it's always been the same

but you were certainly In for engineer of the year you can figure out which record
by thinking about the famous company you have been keeping
you may have been on the producer list as well I cannot recall
and cannot really talk in detail about the list anyway
but fingers crossed
they only ever announce the winner of that catergory
So if you didn't know and don't win
well I guess you know somebody was thinking of you
while you were using that u 89 !

East village music, 21 east 3rd st

is one that comes to mind, what type of gear are you looking for?

Great suggestions...

I'm looking for quality recording gear especially mics but interested in whatever...

M

hey rick, can i get you to talk down old lexicon reverbs too? i'd really like the price of those to drop a bit so i can afford to buy a 224X.

i just put the U89 on my shopping list in anticipation of it becoming completely out of fashion, along with a pair of (vintage) 414EBs ;-)

I posted this a day or so ago but must not have hit the go button......
Get in touch with John Klett.
http://www.technicalaudio.com/contact.html
++1 845.225.0699

John Klett and Tech Mecca Inc. are based near Carmel, NY - about 90 minutes North of mid-town Manhattan, NYC. John does some of his work in conjunction with the exile shop in Long Island City - about 15 minutes from mid-town Manhattan.

wez wrote:hey rick, can i get you to talk down old lexicon reverbs too? i'd really like the price of those to drop a bit so i can afford to buy a 224X.

i just put the U89 on my shopping list in anticipation of it becoming completely out of fashion, along with a pair of (vintage) 414EBs ;-)

Sure wez happy to help
i have always thought the old 224 was a piece of junk I have had two I sold the first one because it kept spacking out
and never worked when I needed it to
I bought a 2 nd one because I thought I was just unlucky
it behaved the same way so I sold it
I can't work a 480 l like the big boys can either I just cannot figure out why it's so loved
but when they drop down to $1000 I will probably try and figure out just why some of us feel anger toward them

give me an ams rmx 16 over a lexicon anyday
well that is a rmx 16 that works !
Now there is a tail of woe for the uninitiated
trying to keep your ams reverb working
I like the small room with a 1.8 sec tail on a PCM 70 though
oh yeah I couldn't believe the post the other day about the PCM 60
that thing is truely horrible!
Vintage digital give me a break!

perfect thanks rick!