Turtlerock Forum

What are people liking for studio tracking the band all in as a vocal mic?
I have space to get the vocalist isolated but they are often playing electric gtr at the same time and the top end spill into an LDC can cause issues once you start compressing the vocal come mix time. I usually retrack the lead vocal, but would like to find something tight enough so that if it came down to it the live vocal could be used.
Any thoughts?

Thanks

SM7b is the obvious one, but doesn't work for all voices.

Just the other day, I was doing some vocals with an acoustic guitar in my hand, and I just threw up audix om5, what struck me was the total lack of bleed, the rejection of the mic was great...you reminded me I wanted to look into that more... look at the rejection pattern of the OM5 etc... don't remember the vocal being recorded good or bad, just remember the rejection...

I really like the SE H1, a hand held vocal condenser for this. Also the good old SM 58 for louder singers.
Another method i used a while back for female vox tracked with the band was a Beyer Soundstar together with a Neumann KM85 gaffered on top with a foam pop filter. It ended up being a real advantage at mix down, adjusting the level of the two mics to get tonal variation instead of just using eq.

SM58 or beta version.

Yeah boring I know, but they work.

A Heil PR-40 might be a surprise package - they have tremendous rear and side rejection, a bit of proximity (not as extreme as an RE-20) and crisp top end.

Also perhaps a Heil PR30 or md421.

Also be interested in how the Telefunken M80 or M81s would go.

well all the ones i use live when i need to "reject" are mentioned

the heil is great - but its very "thick" (which may or may not be a good thing)

the audix OM stuff i could never work out
yes they reject - but they sort of reject everything - including the vocal! i find that unless the singer is right ontop of it, they just don't work. and not all singers have their mouth on the mic all the time

Beta 57 is way tighter than a B58 (and for a girl i think sounds better) with a nice pre its definitely useable at mix down (see my live brooke fraser releases, B57 into neve)

421 can def work (see the article i wrote in unmentionable about their use live and particularly patrick watson (to build a home by cinematic orchestra)

also consider small gobos… a little in the right place can go a long way
for instance with brooke i always put something between the hi hat and her - and it was "enough to get you out of trouble" as that was the real problem freq/ instrument/ bleed.

Some good suggestions to check out there. Thanks.Anyone had experience with the Shure KSM9?

gigpiglet wrote:well all the ones i use live when i need to "reject" are mentioned

the heil is great - but its very "thick" (which may or may not be a good thing)

the audix OM stuff i could never work out
yes they reject - but they sort of reject everything - including the vocal! i find that unless the singer is right ontop of it, they just don't work. and not all singers have their mouth on the mic all the time

Beta 57 is way tighter than a B58 (and for a girl i think sounds better) with a nice pre its definitely useable at mix down (see my live brooke fraser releases, B57 into neve)

421 can def work (see the article i wrote in unmentionable about their use live and particularly patrick watson (to build a home by cinematic orchestra)

also consider small gobos… a little in the right place can go a long way
for instance with brooke i always put something between the hi hat and her - and it was "enough to get you out of trouble" as that was the real problem freq/ instrument/ bleed.

Well, I do tend to "lovelace" the mic

Try a nice omni dynamic.
Ev 635 etc. You might be surprised!
Senn 441 is very good live.
Rejection isn't everything. The colour of what ISN'T rejected is very important.
Dynamic mics are good because the sensitivity drops of very quickly with distance.
Gobos help a lot too.
Cheers,
Paul

KSM 9 is nice
but i dont think it will do what you want it to (its off axis is a bit nasty)

as a live (and live recording) guy - what we are talking about is one of my biggest issues!

the neumann KMS105 sounds a lot like the KSM9 (maybe a bit nicer top end)
has similar (if not worse) rejection
but sounds A LOT better off axis

ie: if you have a quiet singer in front of a good band, the KMS is fine as the "mix" you get off it will work
but same situation the KSM will put you in a world of hurt.
wonder why they named them so similarly??

+1 for Sennheiser MD441. Tight pattern ,clean,great on female vocals or MKE- 4032/5032 handheld condenser, the cable version of the 4031 radio mic of the early 90s

another vote for the 441
singer's got to have darn good technique though

441 here too! Great off axis response.
A windsock might be needed.
Its looks great too! For recording it gives a singer a bit more confidence than a 58.

we do a lot of this type of recording.

Blue 200 and 300's are AMAZING in this situation. Audix OM5 has great rejection, but sounds only ok, Beta 58's have the same issue, ok rejection (not directly behind) and yuk tone.