Turtlerock Forum

Hi team.
A studio I'll be using on the opposite side of the country is running a mac pro 4.1 with PT 8HD. I don't know what kind of cards it has at the moment. There is 2 Aurora 16's hooked up so I'm guess whatever was current when PT 8HD was new. I'm sure PT 11HD uses different DSP stuff now so what i'd like to know is could I install PT11 Native/Vanilla and just use the Cards as IO without the use of the DSP processing? Will PT11 even see the old cards like a 3rd party device?
Anyone tried this of know if this is possible. People way smarter than me have usually set up the machines before I enter the studio.
Thanks
SS

I don't think PT 11 vanilla will play nice with the older HD cards - if setup as a core audio device I don't think it will let you access all 32 i/o.

PT11 HD should play with the older hardware, but I wouldn't stake a project on it.

Can you not save sessions as PT8 versions prior to heading over and / or just track in 8 and then move over to 11 when you're back home?

Thanks texty legs.
Usually I do exactly what you are suggesting between 9HD and 10 Native at home. But I want my plugs and some VI's and stuff while tracking this particular project. Moving fast with short attention spans and building the mix as I go. Just spoke to a member of the band with a sparkly new macbook pro and apollo so I'll think I'll use that. Been testing 11 this week and the engine redesign really is impressive with what it can do now as native for tracking with lots of plugs and and low latency, even on my old mac pro 3,1. Officially unqualified but will now squeeze a few more years out of it. So I thought if I could get 11 going on the studios machine, I would.
Ta

Not sure I totally follow what you want to do..
But are you suggesting installing a different version of pt on a studios computer that you are working at??

That's a question for the studio. Not a forum.

Having said that pt HD anything will work with the cards.
A 4.1 mac is on pcie cards so totally current and comparable.

But who knows about os etc etc.

Yes, I wanted to put PT 11 on the computer of the studio I'll be working at.
Agreed Gareth, its probably not the norm at all but its totally a tech question for the forum and a few of the brains here I trust. We love these left of centre questions. I can't pop in and test the theory unfortunately. Its an odd little situation for sure. Lovely kitted out private studio of a musician kind enough to let us use it. In some far off part of the globe touring. Spec'd and built by I don't know who in 2009 I guess. And the person with the keys doesn't know the answer to my question the same as I don't. So, a question for the brains trust of the forum...Can I pop PT 11 (which I have a licence for) on a new hard drive with correct OS in a mac pro with older HD cards (of which I not not the version yet) and have it see the cards as an IO either via PT aggregate or however it wants to display them. Wondering if someone had tried it.
But, all a mute point now as I have what I feel I need. And I do love odd situations and strange requests of the studios I use. Thats why there is a loom running through the ceiling from the Neve room to the lounge at Sing SIng. Another silly request, but as you correctly point out, a request made in this case to lovely and accommodating studio owners.

I haven't used an emoticon yet on turtlerock and although spoilt for choice I can't see what would be appropriate.
So here is a puppy.

I was under the impression PT11HD is 64 bit.
The cards for PT8 HD would be TDM cards, PCI or PCIe which are all 48 bit.
Therefore the old cards, I think, won't be supported by PT11HD.

You would need either the native card or HDX for PT11HD which support the 64bit software.

Thats what I was thinking for HD Matt. I thought the IO in PT11HD would have "pffft" as an option. But for PT 11 native? I don't know.

No, you can't use any form of PT11 with TDM cards - Core Audio (Native) or otherwise (Aggregate).

sorry steven
i wasnt meaning to "shut you down"
just seemed like a very odd question to not be asking the studio - but as you point out - life is full of the "weird ones" and thats part of the fun.

seems you have the answer you need above.

but a slightly off topic though very useful bit of info for anyone in "similar" situation
i found out (by fulfilling odd requests for people) that if you use PT agregate for another program to "see" you HD cards, it only ever sees an 8io device.
doesnt matter if you have HD3 or whatever, "HD" is only ever seen as 8io.
weird.

That's interesting, I had been told the 192i/o (which is what I believe the lynx is pretending to be) would work with pt11 nd native, but isn't officially supported. Very interesting it won't show up as a core audio device with vanilla.

hold on dave
you are talking interfaces now..
we were talking HD cards before (inside the computer)

i read an old 192 will work (though not supported) like a lynx will

but from the convo above is about old style HD cards, or new "native" cards.

yeah?

or have we all gone off the track?

Maybe I misunderstood the question?

Engininja wrote:what i'd like to know is could I install PT11 Native/Vanilla and just use the Cards as IO without the use of the DSP processing? Will PT11 even see the old cards like a 3rd party device?

I thought PT11 HD would be able to interface with the Lynx's (accessing the i/o but bypassing the dsp *as in, the cards) and PT11 Vanilla would see the i/o via core-audio. I'm really interested that the latter isn't the case - I love the brains trust here.

im bowing out!

as well documented here im holding back on going to 11
all my machines (apart from my brand new laptop as of yesterday) are staying on lion/ PT 10/ old cards
working for me now and hopefully will do so for another couple of years

Couldn't you just create an aggregate device in the Mac's audio/midi setup that contains the Auroras then access that in the PT11 setup? Dunno...maybe...? I do something like that with PT11 on my Macbook so I can use the outputs of a duet 1 as well as the laptop speaker out. Would need the Aurora drivers installed, I don't know if HD8 needs them when it uses the cards?

Yes, a tricky one. Can't just pop in and test it. Its all about the cards. Pretty sure the interfaces all work (possibly unsupported) with the new HD cards.
A grunty computer with PT11 vanilla, old cards and interfaces? Could that be a cheapish 32IO rig?
But, no one knows if it works.
Thanks everyone for chiming in.
Thats what its all about.

I'm working with a guy in London still on PT9.
Obviously the sessions are incompatible, so I save my PT11 songs as PT9 to send to him.
Not sure if this helps at all? But I would just use whatever PT version the studio has, then open the files in PT11 when you get home.

I believe the most robust method to get the Auroa's recognised would be to use a Native card, either PCIe or Thunderbolt box type.
Although the method of communication is along the lines of the Digidesign 192 protocol, Avid says they don't support these devices with PT11 but there is plenty of success documented on Gearslutz & the DUC.

As I said above, Pro Tools 11 will not in any way shape or form let you use a TDM card - no matter how logical you think it is. There are issues at a hardware level that can't be overcome in a 64bit computing environment (I think this MAY be more of an issue on a Mac, rather than a PC)

With regard to the old Blue interfaces, yes these are "unsupported" but continue to work without an problems. Just Avid's way of a disclaimer to pull them off the test grid. I currently use a 96i/o daisy chained off my new generation HD I/O with absolutely no dramas. Just connect as you would have any old interfaces with the loop-sync in/out loops and a couple of BNCs. You just need the mini-digilink to digilink cable to hook to either the new interface or the cards in the computer.

Getting an Aurora to work with PT11 you can: A) Use a HDX Card B) Use a HD-Native Card C) Use a HD-Native Thunderbolt or D) Put one of the Thunderbolt/Firewire expansion boards in the Aurora box and use it without a card with Core audio or ASIO. Again, it won't work attached to a TDM card.

That's interesting - I believe Logic X can access 'see' TDM hardware as an 8 i/o core audio device. Logic X (I believe) is 64 bit. Wonder what's different?

Getting an Aurora to work with PT11 you can: A) Use a HDX Card B) Use a HD-Native Card C) Use a HD-Native Thunderbolt or D) Put one of the Thunderbolt/Firewire expansion boards in the Aurora box and use it without a card with Core audio or ASIO. Again, it won't work attached to a TDM card.

Really? Not even use AES via hd26 cables to your AES cards on computer (mac pro in my case) and run PT11/Aurora I/O via an aggregate?

Not poking a stick or anything - would just really like to know! As just upgraded to PT10 but in doing so, these days, you can't simply buy a 10 licence but rather a 10/11 bundle... thanks avid.

cheers

dave01.cooper wrote:

Getting an Aurora to work with PT11 you can: A) Use a HDX Card B) Use a HD-Native Card C) Use a HD-Native Thunderbolt or D) Put one of the Thunderbolt/Firewire expansion boards in the Aurora box and use it without a card with Core audio or ASIO. Again, it won't work attached to a TDM card.

Really? Not even use AES via hd26 cables to your AES cards on computer (mac pro in my case) and run PT11/Aurora I/O via an aggregate?

Not poking a stick or anything - would just really like to know! As just upgraded to PT10 but in doing so, these days, you can't simply buy a 10 licence but rather a 10/11 bundle... thanks avid.

cheers

Poking is fine...

Of course you can run it AES to an AES interface, I didn't fully qualify my "D" statement above with all the options (I don't know what all the aurora interface options are) - meaning that anything other than a digilink connector would work in native mode.