Hi everyone, Adam B from SNJ Recording Studio. I've been lurking in these forums without registering for a while but lately I have had a few things on my mind that I wanted to talk to fellow Aussie studio people about so I'm signed up. It is great to have place to bitch about running a studio in Australia, I love it but it's such a hard road as there are so few clients who have a budget to spend on music production to justify having a "world-class" facility. 301 wouldn't be here today without SAE, MilkBar is gone and Festival is basically SAE Byron Bay now. I have heard most of the other big studios are getting into massive debt, or have been bought out by non-musical corporations (Mangrove). I chat online to American and European engineers and it seems most have plenty of good paying clients to sustain a career and fit out their setups with new SSL's, that kind of situation seems reserved for quite a small group here in Australia, and most of that group work mostly overseas... Hey this wasn't in my SAE course!!! Feels good to rant. Sorry. Haven't had my "Sophie Monk nipple drying" experience in my studio yet, this thought keeps me goin'.
I have been running my studio fulltime as a business for about 8 years now, and I have to cut every ounce of fat of the overhead costs. If you have been to my studio in Artarmon you will see this in action; looking pretty and having optional extras that do not contribute to the sound of my final product has much less priority than great gear, a 2 inch machine and the biggest recording space I can afford. For the first few years of going fulltime I decided to use the services of a professional accountant, I wanted to make sure I was claiming everything entitled to me as a studio owner/operator and that I was above board legally with the Tax Department. I had a few meetings with the accountant to learn how to keep the books, make it easier for a speedy processing. I lodged all documents when GST started (Thanks Johnny! As a studio owner I fail to see how GST has done anything to my life except paperwork and 11% less profit!!!) and my accountants did the yearly income tax.
It seemed I was getting a pretty good return each time, especially in the first few years when I was spending lots of cash on setting up and aquiring new gear. But the accountants fee was just about as big as my returns! And then when the studio started making profit and less purchases were being made the returns were smaller and the accountant became fat to cut - YOU'RE FIRED. The accountant didn't even specialise in the music biz, the family already used them but I just couldn't burdern the cost, and I have been told that the fees I was paying were high. I have since continued to keep my books up to date and lodge quarterly GST, but I need to deal with my income tax.
My question is for any studio people who do your own income tax return - is it as hard as I think it will be? What is the process - do you get forms from the tax office, do they have instructions on how to fill out sections? What are some typical things studio people can claim, or more importantly things we think we could claim but cannot? Are the majority DIY or is there a cheap option for us Aussie Studio Battlers? I should ask the tax office but I have this fear that some siren on their phone goes off when I call with the words "SEVERE AUDIT" stenciled on.
Thanks for any advice!
Adam B - SNJ Recording Studio
www.snjstudio.com
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Studio Owners and TAX
Moderators: rick, Mark Bassett
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Studio Owners and TAX
by SNJ Studio » Thu Oct 19, 2006 6:18 pm
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by Kris » Thu Oct 19, 2006 7:10 pm
I hope this doesn't sound harsh but I would like to say some things...
Just so you know...
Milkbar is bigger and better than ever, thanks to Phil Punch, it is now Electric Avenue.
As for Mangrove...umm.... It's owned by Darlene Zschech. If you can show me a bigger musical earner in Australia than her then I'll buy you a beer. One of her songs (Shout To The Lord) is sung approximately 3 million times a week around the world. Do the math on those royalties. She represents one of the biggest selling Australian "acts" of all time with millions of dollars sold annually.
She's hardly a "non-musical corporation". I would suggest checking your sources before posting such generalisations.
As for your studio, if I was coming to record in any studio, I would want some comfy couches, a coffee machine of high quality, a playstation to keep the non-essential-at-the-moment-people occupied and internet access. To me, as a client, those are the things I want if I'm going to be spending long hours at your studio. Almost to the point that the gear is secondary to the overall experience. Of course, combine the two and you're on a winner.
Don't mess with tax. Get an accountant. You're good at recording because
you do it all day. Accountants are worthwhile for the same reasons.
and for what it's worth, I think 10% GST is better than the 22% sales tax that went before it.
Just so you know...
Milkbar is bigger and better than ever, thanks to Phil Punch, it is now Electric Avenue.
As for Mangrove...umm.... It's owned by Darlene Zschech. If you can show me a bigger musical earner in Australia than her then I'll buy you a beer. One of her songs (Shout To The Lord) is sung approximately 3 million times a week around the world. Do the math on those royalties. She represents one of the biggest selling Australian "acts" of all time with millions of dollars sold annually.
She's hardly a "non-musical corporation". I would suggest checking your sources before posting such generalisations.
As for your studio, if I was coming to record in any studio, I would want some comfy couches, a coffee machine of high quality, a playstation to keep the non-essential-at-the-moment-people occupied and internet access. To me, as a client, those are the things I want if I'm going to be spending long hours at your studio. Almost to the point that the gear is secondary to the overall experience. Of course, combine the two and you're on a winner.
Don't mess with tax. Get an accountant. You're good at recording because
you do it all day. Accountants are worthwhile for the same reasons.
and for what it's worth, I think 10% GST is better than the 22% sales tax that went before it.
- Kris
by chris p » Thu Oct 19, 2006 7:58 pm
Hi there SNJ, and welcome onboard
This is the small business dilemma in a nutshell. At what part does the cost of professional services outweight the benefit? And are you willing to jump on the learning curve to do it yourself instead? Its your business, and so its your call based on your skills, time and risk profile. Thats the joy of business ownership!
FWIW my main business, which is not music, is a two person, one fee earner affair not too dissimilar to what you describe. The other person (my greatly appreciated and much adored wife of over 22 years) has done the learning curve bit to get our MYOB accounts system running like a clock, and she also does our BAS and chasing clients for outstanding bills. She is salaried by the business at a level commensurate with her duties.
Business tax returns are to me an arcane art, so we give our MYOB files to our accountant for a once-a-year look over, and filing of tax returns for me and my wife. I don't know what you were paying, but this little bit of security costs us less than $1k per year, which includes an annual chat about how things might be improved in the fiscal management department.
My only advice (other than to echo Kris's comments, which are spot on) would be to question whether you see yourself in competition with Electric Av, Studios301 et al? If so, I suspect your on a losing game. The small business survival guide is the niche - find something that you can do that the big boys cannot copy economically. Artarmon is well placed for TV and advertising work, do you get much of that?
The other Business 101 is that cost cutting is important for efficiency, but deadly as a means of maintaining profit. Success only comes from sales.
Anyway, lets see what others say.
This is the small business dilemma in a nutshell. At what part does the cost of professional services outweight the benefit? And are you willing to jump on the learning curve to do it yourself instead? Its your business, and so its your call based on your skills, time and risk profile. Thats the joy of business ownership!
FWIW my main business, which is not music, is a two person, one fee earner affair not too dissimilar to what you describe. The other person (my greatly appreciated and much adored wife of over 22 years) has done the learning curve bit to get our MYOB accounts system running like a clock, and she also does our BAS and chasing clients for outstanding bills. She is salaried by the business at a level commensurate with her duties.
Business tax returns are to me an arcane art, so we give our MYOB files to our accountant for a once-a-year look over, and filing of tax returns for me and my wife. I don't know what you were paying, but this little bit of security costs us less than $1k per year, which includes an annual chat about how things might be improved in the fiscal management department.
My only advice (other than to echo Kris's comments, which are spot on) would be to question whether you see yourself in competition with Electric Av, Studios301 et al? If so, I suspect your on a losing game. The small business survival guide is the niche - find something that you can do that the big boys cannot copy economically. Artarmon is well placed for TV and advertising work, do you get much of that?
The other Business 101 is that cost cutting is important for efficiency, but deadly as a means of maintaining profit. Success only comes from sales.
Anyway, lets see what others say.
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by Linear » Thu Oct 19, 2006 8:00 pm
gee, that was a bit harsh!
I think the point he was trying to make is that it's pretty tough to own a studio, and yes Milkbar is no more - full stop. Electric Avenue basically moved in, and in many ways this is almost the ~only~ way to make a large studio profitable (let someone else build it, go broke and then move in). It happens all the time.
And I've never heard of Darlene Zschech, and I'm sure most who aren't involved in praising the lord haven't either. So it isn't exactly mainstream recording, so I think that was his point.
It's a pretty tough call to read someones website and then start criticising the way they do business - basically studios aren't very profitable so some do away with 'extras' to cut down on the rate. If you want expensive coffee machines, big comfy couches, broadband and a sony playstation, then go to singsing or 301 and pay triple the amount.
But anyway, back to the question. I think the best way to do the tax stuff is to find an accountant who is prepared to show you how to do all the legwork, and then just present him or her an excel spreadsheet with everything already entered. Then they just need to go through, get the totals and go from there. Most accountants are happy for you to do this, as it saves them trawling through shoeboxes full of receipts. They can guide you with what you need to enter (ie separating receipts into expenses and capital, setting up a depreciation schedule etc).
Then when the return is prepared (and all the queries are answered by yourself) then they can lodge it for you.
The good thing is if you already do your quarterly BAS, then alot of the work is already done.
That's how I do it.
Chris
I think the point he was trying to make is that it's pretty tough to own a studio, and yes Milkbar is no more - full stop. Electric Avenue basically moved in, and in many ways this is almost the ~only~ way to make a large studio profitable (let someone else build it, go broke and then move in). It happens all the time.
And I've never heard of Darlene Zschech, and I'm sure most who aren't involved in praising the lord haven't either. So it isn't exactly mainstream recording, so I think that was his point.
It's a pretty tough call to read someones website and then start criticising the way they do business - basically studios aren't very profitable so some do away with 'extras' to cut down on the rate. If you want expensive coffee machines, big comfy couches, broadband and a sony playstation, then go to singsing or 301 and pay triple the amount.
But anyway, back to the question. I think the best way to do the tax stuff is to find an accountant who is prepared to show you how to do all the legwork, and then just present him or her an excel spreadsheet with everything already entered. Then they just need to go through, get the totals and go from there. Most accountants are happy for you to do this, as it saves them trawling through shoeboxes full of receipts. They can guide you with what you need to enter (ie separating receipts into expenses and capital, setting up a depreciation schedule etc).
Then when the return is prepared (and all the queries are answered by yourself) then they can lodge it for you.
The good thing is if you already do your quarterly BAS, then alot of the work is already done.
That's how I do it.
Chris
- Linear
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by Kris » Thu Oct 19, 2006 8:18 pm
sorry...i'm not sure what happened there.... i had some extra lines that did not get posted....
they were....
Even though it may sound harsh it's not meant to be a bring down. I applaud you for starting your own business and going for it. I also wanted to say welcome to the fourm..... but that may be a bit late now!!!
I haven't seen the studio....just making suggestions for what i would like to have access to as a client.
they were....
Even though it may sound harsh it's not meant to be a bring down. I applaud you for starting your own business and going for it. I also wanted to say welcome to the fourm..... but that may be a bit late now!!!
I haven't seen the studio....just making suggestions for what i would like to have access to as a client.
- Kris
by Henry » Thu Oct 19, 2006 9:02 pm
All the Big Studio's have gone under! All of them!
Festival, Milk Bar, Paradise, Sony, even 301 went under but was bought out for nix at the 11th hour.
Just think of big Studio and.....yes it went broke!!
Festival, Milk Bar, Paradise, Sony, even 301 went under but was bought out for nix at the 11th hour.
Just think of big Studio and.....yes it went broke!!
- Henry
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- Location: Sydney
by SNJ Studio » Thu Oct 19, 2006 9:24 pm
Thanks for the replies.
First up, it seems that I am silly to consider DIY tax. Thanks for the honesty - are there any suggestions for someone to contact or a company that would be a good starting point for a small business? Less than 1K per year, that's more reasonable... Chris, your tips are appreciated. Yes Artarmon is advertsing cerntral but I guess I am about to reveal my biggest problem - I only record bands & artists original material, trying to be the next Butch Vig, ya know? Looking for that breakthough song.
I do not consider my studio in competition with the likes of 301, although I have no hesitation to say many things I have heard done on lower end budgets there sound terrible and I could and have bettered it. I wont compete with someone who spends a month in a great studio with a name engineer. If your budget is under 5K, that is where I think SNJ is the best option.
I am not going to pretend I research any of the things I say, studio land is rife with rumor and simply sounding out what bounces around my place, set me straight if you know the facts. Mangrove was bought by Hillsong Church from what I heard, yeah you can say the Christian music market counts. Having to use Christian music as an example of how healthy the Oz music business is just under scores my point as a rock and roll studio. I heard "no more heavy partying bands will be allowed to book sessions" at Mangrove and I wonder if they would let Slayer do any demo's? I think this is pathetic and they are struck off the creative roster in my mind.
Phil Punch is a great guy, he lends me a test tone tape sometimes. BUT MilkBar is no more and I hear big debts still hang around, and he got in on someone else's failed attempt. I used to book MilkBar for tracking and thought it was the bomb, I designed my life to one day on something like it. Talk about dis-illusioned.
Quote "As for your studio, if I was coming to record in any studio, I would want some comfy couches, a coffee machine of high quality, a playstation to keep the non-essential-at-the-moment-people occupied and internet access. To me, as a client, those are the things I want if I'm going to be spending long hours at your studio."
I agree. I have 3 massive plush leather couches (donated in mint condition by ex clients). I will challenge any fool to espresso competition, I can brew an elixer than will wake drummers up at 4:20am. Playstation is available, but you know what? I hardly ever gets turned on, too much fun to be had with music. I thought it would be worn out in a month. There is net access and I have to say that in gerneral musicians are the sickest puppies to grace our planet, how many times can I watch some woman squirt?
Quote "Almost to the point that the gear is secondary to the overall experience."
I whole heartedly dis-agree with this statement. Call it piss-in-my-pocket but every client of my studio says they love the "grungy" no frills studio design. What is missing in looks and made up in enthusiasm, passion and tht elusive term VIBE.
When you go to 301 you know that secretary gets paid? My profit margin is pretty damn tight, if I am going to start investing money into things that will not improve the quality or quantity of music production in my studio, it has to come from the money I charge for said production. I want to do it, but I find myself stuck in a bit of a catch 22. Maybe I should "Shout To The Lord" for help, or deal with the Devil and do a Maccas ad jingle.
First up, it seems that I am silly to consider DIY tax. Thanks for the honesty - are there any suggestions for someone to contact or a company that would be a good starting point for a small business? Less than 1K per year, that's more reasonable... Chris, your tips are appreciated. Yes Artarmon is advertsing cerntral but I guess I am about to reveal my biggest problem - I only record bands & artists original material, trying to be the next Butch Vig, ya know? Looking for that breakthough song.
I do not consider my studio in competition with the likes of 301, although I have no hesitation to say many things I have heard done on lower end budgets there sound terrible and I could and have bettered it. I wont compete with someone who spends a month in a great studio with a name engineer. If your budget is under 5K, that is where I think SNJ is the best option.
I am not going to pretend I research any of the things I say, studio land is rife with rumor and simply sounding out what bounces around my place, set me straight if you know the facts. Mangrove was bought by Hillsong Church from what I heard, yeah you can say the Christian music market counts. Having to use Christian music as an example of how healthy the Oz music business is just under scores my point as a rock and roll studio. I heard "no more heavy partying bands will be allowed to book sessions" at Mangrove and I wonder if they would let Slayer do any demo's? I think this is pathetic and they are struck off the creative roster in my mind.
Phil Punch is a great guy, he lends me a test tone tape sometimes. BUT MilkBar is no more and I hear big debts still hang around, and he got in on someone else's failed attempt. I used to book MilkBar for tracking and thought it was the bomb, I designed my life to one day on something like it. Talk about dis-illusioned.
Quote "As for your studio, if I was coming to record in any studio, I would want some comfy couches, a coffee machine of high quality, a playstation to keep the non-essential-at-the-moment-people occupied and internet access. To me, as a client, those are the things I want if I'm going to be spending long hours at your studio."
I agree. I have 3 massive plush leather couches (donated in mint condition by ex clients). I will challenge any fool to espresso competition, I can brew an elixer than will wake drummers up at 4:20am. Playstation is available, but you know what? I hardly ever gets turned on, too much fun to be had with music. I thought it would be worn out in a month. There is net access and I have to say that in gerneral musicians are the sickest puppies to grace our planet, how many times can I watch some woman squirt?
Quote "Almost to the point that the gear is secondary to the overall experience."
I whole heartedly dis-agree with this statement. Call it piss-in-my-pocket but every client of my studio says they love the "grungy" no frills studio design. What is missing in looks and made up in enthusiasm, passion and tht elusive term VIBE.
When you go to 301 you know that secretary gets paid? My profit margin is pretty damn tight, if I am going to start investing money into things that will not improve the quality or quantity of music production in my studio, it has to come from the money I charge for said production. I want to do it, but I find myself stuck in a bit of a catch 22. Maybe I should "Shout To The Lord" for help, or deal with the Devil and do a Maccas ad jingle.
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by Chris H » Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:48 pm
Here is a quote from Bob Olson who did a lot of engineering of Motown artists and it points to what your business seems to be about.
[quote]
"A studio is by definition a performance space and not a stack of gear. Music that isn't performed live doesn't require a studio, just a stack of gear. We are really comparing high resolution photography to cartoons.
The long term solution lies in facilitating affordable grass roots live music performances that are more compelling than all but the most exceptional sonic cartoons."
In order to keep providing the above which it sounds like your studio is on about, you probably also have to find one or two other sources of cash flow for your studio. A regular quarterly project that brings in a few grand a time can really help.
Then there are the strategies that apply to any business that can help.
I did a business course about 10 years ago and it really helped. It was when i was unemployed and a did the NEIS course to start my recording business after leaving the studio i had been working in. Even if you do a bit of reading it can give strategies for networking , defining and marketing what you have to offer, and attracting bands that are on the way to having a good audience for their music.
Concepts like SWAT analysis and what's my unfair advantage etc, etc come to mind. Maybe you have already done a lot of this stuff, but what i'm getting at is the way forward can be found with applying a bit of lateral thinking and discovering a flow of work / clients from an unlikely or not immediately obvious avenue to complement and consolidate what you have already achieved
[quote]
"A studio is by definition a performance space and not a stack of gear. Music that isn't performed live doesn't require a studio, just a stack of gear. We are really comparing high resolution photography to cartoons.
The long term solution lies in facilitating affordable grass roots live music performances that are more compelling than all but the most exceptional sonic cartoons."
In order to keep providing the above which it sounds like your studio is on about, you probably also have to find one or two other sources of cash flow for your studio. A regular quarterly project that brings in a few grand a time can really help.
Then there are the strategies that apply to any business that can help.
I did a business course about 10 years ago and it really helped. It was when i was unemployed and a did the NEIS course to start my recording business after leaving the studio i had been working in. Even if you do a bit of reading it can give strategies for networking , defining and marketing what you have to offer, and attracting bands that are on the way to having a good audience for their music.
Concepts like SWAT analysis and what's my unfair advantage etc, etc come to mind. Maybe you have already done a lot of this stuff, but what i'm getting at is the way forward can be found with applying a bit of lateral thinking and discovering a flow of work / clients from an unlikely or not immediately obvious avenue to complement and consolidate what you have already achieved
-
Chris H - Forum Veteran
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by Kris » Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:24 pm
The ad-land option is a good one if you're looking for work. Ad agencies pay in 2 hours what most music studios charge for a day, and then they go and mark it up 30% to their client anyway!!! That's where the more upmarket surroundings and coffee machines come in. Agency creatives just can't function without being pampered. :-)
I think you're on a good thing, you have obviously found a market that no-one is servicing adequately and you're capitalising on it.
For the record, The Grove as it is known know, was not purchased by Hillsong. It was bought personally by Mark and Darlene Zschech. Yes, they go to Hillsong. As for the no party bands....well. Not true. But like you said, why bother with distractions when the music is too much fun?
I'm sure you're aware that Eskimo Joe did Black Fingernails there and 67 Special are currently recording there with Jacquire King producing (Mutemath, Good Charlotte etc). Brooke Fraser also has recorded there amongst others and I think Sam Gibson will be coming out from the UK to mix a project there this year as well. (See Neil Finn, Bic Runga, Dave Dobbyn liner notes for Sam's name.)
The Grove is a professional studio and is run as such. Clients are not turned away because they don't adhere to christian values. That's just dumb.
"I wonder if they would let Slayer do any demo's? I think this is pathetic and they are struck off the creative roster in my mind. "
A statement like that just defies logic. Some of the finest engineers in Oz and around the world (David Hemming, Sam Gibson, Reid Shippen, Matt Lovell to name a few) work there and because of prejudiced hearsay you "strike them off". Good grief. Would you ban my band from your studio 'cos we do "christian" music?
You don't have to worry about your finances keeping your studio small. Your mindset is already doing that for you.
I think you're on a good thing, you have obviously found a market that no-one is servicing adequately and you're capitalising on it.
For the record, The Grove as it is known know, was not purchased by Hillsong. It was bought personally by Mark and Darlene Zschech. Yes, they go to Hillsong. As for the no party bands....well. Not true. But like you said, why bother with distractions when the music is too much fun?
I'm sure you're aware that Eskimo Joe did Black Fingernails there and 67 Special are currently recording there with Jacquire King producing (Mutemath, Good Charlotte etc). Brooke Fraser also has recorded there amongst others and I think Sam Gibson will be coming out from the UK to mix a project there this year as well. (See Neil Finn, Bic Runga, Dave Dobbyn liner notes for Sam's name.)
The Grove is a professional studio and is run as such. Clients are not turned away because they don't adhere to christian values. That's just dumb.
"I wonder if they would let Slayer do any demo's? I think this is pathetic and they are struck off the creative roster in my mind. "
A statement like that just defies logic. Some of the finest engineers in Oz and around the world (David Hemming, Sam Gibson, Reid Shippen, Matt Lovell to name a few) work there and because of prejudiced hearsay you "strike them off". Good grief. Would you ban my band from your studio 'cos we do "christian" music?
You don't have to worry about your finances keeping your studio small. Your mindset is already doing that for you.
- Kris
by anj » Fri Oct 20, 2006 1:20 am
Linear .............you took the words right out of my mouth!
Spot on mate.
Im in a similar situation to snj studio.......(but i dont even have 3 leather couches, playstation and internet). i just have a pretty good setup that caters to music not stuck up wankers....grass roots!
I cater to bands that cant afford the big budget studio but want bang for buck, no receptionist or special frills, this keeps me happy and the customer too.
I am as diy as it get and i trim all the fat off....as far as tax goes i add every thing up itemise it then give it to my accountant and then he does my return for under $500...it takes me approx half a day to do this but its simple maths.
And about these mega rich religious music/studio enterprises......................what can i say= elite rich self centered.
Bit harsh but ive had it with "in the name of our lord"
Sorry if ive offended anyone but its my view.
Spot on mate.
Im in a similar situation to snj studio.......(but i dont even have 3 leather couches, playstation and internet). i just have a pretty good setup that caters to music not stuck up wankers....grass roots!
I cater to bands that cant afford the big budget studio but want bang for buck, no receptionist or special frills, this keeps me happy and the customer too.
I am as diy as it get and i trim all the fat off....as far as tax goes i add every thing up itemise it then give it to my accountant and then he does my return for under $500...it takes me approx half a day to do this but its simple maths.
And about these mega rich religious music/studio enterprises......................what can i say= elite rich self centered.
Bit harsh but ive had it with "in the name of our lord"
Sorry if ive offended anyone but its my view.
- anj
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- Location: adelaide
by anj » Fri Oct 20, 2006 1:26 am
Linear .............you took the words right out of my mouth!
Spot on mate.
Im in a similar situation to snj studio.......(but i dont even have 3 leather couches, playstation and internet). i just have a pretty good setup that caters to music not stuck up wankers....grass roots!
I cater to bands that cant afford the big budget studio but want bang for buck, no receptionist or special frills, this keeps me happy and the customer too.
I am as diy as it get and i trim all the fat off....as far as tax goes i add every thing up itemise it then give it to my accountant and then he does my return for under $500...it takes me approx half a day to do this but its simple maths.
And about these mega rich religious music/studio enterprises......................what can i say= elite rich self centered.
Bit harsh but ive had it with "in the name of our lord"
Sorry if ive offended anyone but its my view.
Spot on mate.
Im in a similar situation to snj studio.......(but i dont even have 3 leather couches, playstation and internet). i just have a pretty good setup that caters to music not stuck up wankers....grass roots!
I cater to bands that cant afford the big budget studio but want bang for buck, no receptionist or special frills, this keeps me happy and the customer too.
I am as diy as it get and i trim all the fat off....as far as tax goes i add every thing up itemise it then give it to my accountant and then he does my return for under $500...it takes me approx half a day to do this but its simple maths.
And about these mega rich religious music/studio enterprises......................what can i say= elite rich self centered.
Bit harsh but ive had it with "in the name of our lord"
Sorry if ive offended anyone but its my view.
- anj
- Registered User
- Posts: 157
- Joined: Tue May 10, 2005 4:11 pm
- Location: adelaide
by Linear » Fri Oct 20, 2006 2:28 am
I personally think the old studio model is dead and gone. Large multi-room facilities with million-dollar consoles, reception areas and full-time staff are a thing of the past, especially here in Australia.
It's funny because I wonder how the larger studios here actually get by, even the Electric Avenues and 301's and SingSings - if a band has any kind of budget or major label backing, they tend to go overseas to the UK or US to record. So large studio facilities here aren't just competing against other large studios in Australia, they're competing against serious studios in London, LA and New York. And even those studios with access to the huge markets in Europe and the US are having trouble staying afloat (Cello, Hit Factory, Sear Sound to name a few).
So I think the better studio model these days is for a smaller, more efficient operation with owner/operators that run their businesses on a much smaller scale - akin to cottage industries. The market for these studios are local, self-funded acts of which there are plenty, and I know of lots of studios using this model which do pretty well out of it.
All us small studio guys who read this forum and are trying to make something out of this game should remember a few things - our competition is not each other. Our real competition is DIY recording and the stores that pimp all this cheapass recording gear. Imagine if bands spent their recording gear budget on recording studios instead!
Almost every band meet have attempted to record their own stuff, and have found out the hard and expensive way that it just produces crap that isn't really usable.
BUT ANYWAY. it's late, and i'm tired. Chris H, it's OHLSSON and yes the guy really knows his stuff (we should collate his forums posts into a book).
Kris, chill out. You seem to have that 'hi i'm kris and i'm a christian' chip on your shoulder. if it makes you feel any better, i'm a devout athiest and i find this to be depressing at the best of times.
SNJ, hang in there. Forget jingles and other sources of income, you might find that it inadvertantly becomes your main source of income (ie be careful with what you're good at, because you inevitably end up doing alot of it - I've learnt that from personal experience). Concentrate on your own thing and be thankful that you're doing something you enjoy.
Just my 2c.
Chris
It's funny because I wonder how the larger studios here actually get by, even the Electric Avenues and 301's and SingSings - if a band has any kind of budget or major label backing, they tend to go overseas to the UK or US to record. So large studio facilities here aren't just competing against other large studios in Australia, they're competing against serious studios in London, LA and New York. And even those studios with access to the huge markets in Europe and the US are having trouble staying afloat (Cello, Hit Factory, Sear Sound to name a few).
So I think the better studio model these days is for a smaller, more efficient operation with owner/operators that run their businesses on a much smaller scale - akin to cottage industries. The market for these studios are local, self-funded acts of which there are plenty, and I know of lots of studios using this model which do pretty well out of it.
All us small studio guys who read this forum and are trying to make something out of this game should remember a few things - our competition is not each other. Our real competition is DIY recording and the stores that pimp all this cheapass recording gear. Imagine if bands spent their recording gear budget on recording studios instead!
Almost every band meet have attempted to record their own stuff, and have found out the hard and expensive way that it just produces crap that isn't really usable.
BUT ANYWAY. it's late, and i'm tired. Chris H, it's OHLSSON and yes the guy really knows his stuff (we should collate his forums posts into a book).
Kris, chill out. You seem to have that 'hi i'm kris and i'm a christian' chip on your shoulder. if it makes you feel any better, i'm a devout athiest and i find this to be depressing at the best of times.
SNJ, hang in there. Forget jingles and other sources of income, you might find that it inadvertantly becomes your main source of income (ie be careful with what you're good at, because you inevitably end up doing alot of it - I've learnt that from personal experience). Concentrate on your own thing and be thankful that you're doing something you enjoy.
Just my 2c.
Chris
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by Kris » Fri Oct 20, 2006 9:20 am
no chip Linear, just don't like when people believe things that aren't true without researching the facts, spread them around as though they are true and then bag it out because it's successful.
If you read my posts, I have stated that I think what SNJ is doing is cool. I just don't understand why people pay out on Hillsong (and I don't go there) and people like Darlene when they have attained the sort of (audio) success we all aspire to. It seems so at odds with the passions of most people here. It's got nothing to do with me going to church etc.
I hope that makes sense. The problem with posts and emails is that tone doesn't get conveyed. I'm not agro about it, just expressing an alternate viewpoint.
If you read my posts, I have stated that I think what SNJ is doing is cool. I just don't understand why people pay out on Hillsong (and I don't go there) and people like Darlene when they have attained the sort of (audio) success we all aspire to. It seems so at odds with the passions of most people here. It's got nothing to do with me going to church etc.
I hope that makes sense. The problem with posts and emails is that tone doesn't get conveyed. I'm not agro about it, just expressing an alternate viewpoint.
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by otto ruiter » Fri Oct 20, 2006 11:26 am
"All the Big Studio's have gone under! All of them! Festival, Milk Bar, Paradise, Sony, even 301 went under but was bought out for nix at the 11th hour. "
Festival didn't go broke. Sony was a corporate decision, nothing to do with viability (it made a 6 figure yearly profit). 301 didn't go under either, and SAE paid handsomely for it.
Festival didn't go broke. Sony was a corporate decision, nothing to do with viability (it made a 6 figure yearly profit). 301 didn't go under either, and SAE paid handsomely for it.
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by Linear » Fri Oct 20, 2006 11:46 am
"All the Big Studio's have gone under! All of them! Festival, Milk Bar, Paradise, Sony, even 301 went under but was bought out for nix at the 11th hour. "
Festival didn't go broke. Sony was a corporate decision, nothing to do with viability (it made a 6 figure yearly profit). 301 didn't go under either, and SAE paid handsomely for it.
Otto,
I don't claim to know everything about what happened to Sony or 301.
But from a business sense, just because it was making a profit didn't mean that it was a viable business.
No doubt somebody in the company looked at:
a) the capital costs of the business;
b) the return on investment;
c) the value of the asset;
d) the opportunity cost of the studio in the context of the whole business;
e) projected future maintenance, capital and running costs, and;
f) projected future income.
And i'd say that it was better for the corporate bottom line to sell the asset and use the proceeds for a more profitable part of the business.
Many (smart) people in the industry say that the recording studios are really in the real estate business, not the entertainment business.
Chris
Last edited by Linear on Fri Oct 20, 2006 12:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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by Chris H » Fri Oct 20, 2006 11:53 am
Linear wrote:"
Many (smart) people in the industry say that the recording studios are really in the real estate business, not the entertainment business.
Chris
Might as well invest in a Macdonalds ( or is that McDonalds ) restaraunt...
......restaurant.....rest....AU...rant....???
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by astrovic » Fri Oct 20, 2006 12:11 pm
I can think of 2 reasons why I'd use an accountant, irrespective of anything else:
1) Studios obviously invest heavily in plant and equipment (studio gear), much of which would not be able to be wholly deducted in the year of purchase but rather depreciated over time. Accountants are (well, should be) fully across the proper depreciation rates to make sure you get the full benefit of this.
2) Capital gains tax. If you buy or sell an asset, it has capital gains consequences. In a recording studio's situation, quite likely if you bought piece of gear and sold it later, then it would have dropped in value so you'd have a capital loss. There's no direct tax consequences there, but you can offset capital losses against later capital gains and minimise your CGT down the track (an example of a capital gain might be if youy studio was a roaring success and you sold it for a great price to Hillsong and turned a handsome profit :)) An accountant can help keep track of and properly account for CGT events, which might be minimal most of the time but still need to be addressed.
These items are probably not big bikkies in the grand scheme of things, but they do need to be taken care of and properly accounted for.
Otherwise, the other guys have given you some great advice about minimising the accountant's costs by keeping your own day to day books. MYOB/Quickbooks/even an excel spreadsheet make your accountant's job that much easier and his fees that much lower.
FWIW, last year I moved from being an employee to going into business (non-music), so for the first time I've had to employ an accountant (my business, which is a partnership with a colleague, also has its own accountant as well). As an employee I was comfortable doing my own returns as I never really had any meaningful deductions to claim (ok, I could have found a few here or there, but it wasn't really worth the effort) but now I'm in business I feel much more comfortable having an accountant making sure its all done right the first time. I'm lucky in the sense that my wife is a bookeeper by trade and whilst I'm not an accountant, I've worked for accountants before and have a lot of experience with financial and management accounting issues, tax issues and business structuring issues, so this helps us to makes things easy for our accountant. I still won't DIY though...
Oh, a third reason for using an accountant which sometimes can come in handy - if you lodge your return yourself, you have to do so by 31 October and you'll be paying tax by mid-November(ish). If your accountant lodges it for you, you still lodge by 31 October but you go onto some tax payment program and your tax isn't payable until May the following year. If you're facing a big tax bill (like I am!), I know when I'd prefer to pay it...OTTH, if you're due a refund, you don't have to go on the program and you can get the refund straight away (at least that's how my accountant explained it to me).
Hope this helps
Chris
1) Studios obviously invest heavily in plant and equipment (studio gear), much of which would not be able to be wholly deducted in the year of purchase but rather depreciated over time. Accountants are (well, should be) fully across the proper depreciation rates to make sure you get the full benefit of this.
2) Capital gains tax. If you buy or sell an asset, it has capital gains consequences. In a recording studio's situation, quite likely if you bought piece of gear and sold it later, then it would have dropped in value so you'd have a capital loss. There's no direct tax consequences there, but you can offset capital losses against later capital gains and minimise your CGT down the track (an example of a capital gain might be if youy studio was a roaring success and you sold it for a great price to Hillsong and turned a handsome profit :)) An accountant can help keep track of and properly account for CGT events, which might be minimal most of the time but still need to be addressed.
These items are probably not big bikkies in the grand scheme of things, but they do need to be taken care of and properly accounted for.
Otherwise, the other guys have given you some great advice about minimising the accountant's costs by keeping your own day to day books. MYOB/Quickbooks/even an excel spreadsheet make your accountant's job that much easier and his fees that much lower.
FWIW, last year I moved from being an employee to going into business (non-music), so for the first time I've had to employ an accountant (my business, which is a partnership with a colleague, also has its own accountant as well). As an employee I was comfortable doing my own returns as I never really had any meaningful deductions to claim (ok, I could have found a few here or there, but it wasn't really worth the effort) but now I'm in business I feel much more comfortable having an accountant making sure its all done right the first time. I'm lucky in the sense that my wife is a bookeeper by trade and whilst I'm not an accountant, I've worked for accountants before and have a lot of experience with financial and management accounting issues, tax issues and business structuring issues, so this helps us to makes things easy for our accountant. I still won't DIY though...
Oh, a third reason for using an accountant which sometimes can come in handy - if you lodge your return yourself, you have to do so by 31 October and you'll be paying tax by mid-November(ish). If your accountant lodges it for you, you still lodge by 31 October but you go onto some tax payment program and your tax isn't payable until May the following year. If you're facing a big tax bill (like I am!), I know when I'd prefer to pay it...OTTH, if you're due a refund, you don't have to go on the program and you can get the refund straight away (at least that's how my accountant explained it to me).
Hope this helps
Chris
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by otto ruiter » Fri Oct 20, 2006 12:29 pm
I don't claim to know everything about what happened to Sony or 301.
But from a business sense, just because it was making a profit didn't mean that it was a viable business.
No doubt somebody in the company looked at:
a) the capital costs of the business;
b) the return on investment;
c) the value of the asset;
d) the opportunity cost of the studio in the context of the whole business.
And i'd say that it was better for the corporate bottom line to sell the asset and use the proceeds for a more profitable part of the business.
Many (smart) people in the industry say that the recording studios are really in the real estate business, not the entertainment business.
Chris
You're right about one thing - you don't know what went on at Sony. The asset is not sold, in fact it is still operating on a daily basis doing in-house work.
- otto ruiter
by Linear » Fri Oct 20, 2006 12:41 pm
You're right, I have no idea what's going on at Sony. Howard posted this though some time ago, and it sounds like he knew what was going on...
Here's the story in brief... there is "no deal". The studios are located in the basement of the Sony BMG headquarters building in Sydney and access and alarm systems are tightly integrated with the rest of the building so there is zero scope for any outside person or organisation to take on the running of the facility.
Most everyone involved with the running of the studios got the bullet prior to Xmas. Actually, because they were sub-contract rather than staff members, the company just took the approach of failing to advise them as to whether their services would ever be required again. In other words, f..k off but we haven't got the guts to tell you straight. Ross A'Hern, the studio manager, was a salaried staff member and he finished up on Xmas eve.
The powers that be gutted the equipment from Studio B prior to pulling it apart to turn into offices. They had the builders ready to go in but then froze the work - it transpired that the local geniuses had not received the okay from New York to do this. As things stand, the company has no idea what it wants to do with either the studio or the equipment.
Studio A is being used for some A&R development work. The main monitors - beautiful ATC-300s - have already been blown up, so the studio assistant is doing mixes on nearfields.
The company has been shopping the Neve console around but, apart from that, appears not to have taken any firm decision on what they are going to do from here.
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by rick » Fri Oct 20, 2006 1:28 pm
i dont what to make comments on all the other big studios around that have "gone broke" worldwide
what i can tell you is milkbar never went broke, they started a business from a totally unrealistic position
90 % of businesses go broke in the first two years
milkbar falls into that pot
i control the building now i know the sums and electric avenue moved in because i invited phil in to offset my rent .
if his business does not run pretty much fulltime or my business does run pretty much full time there would not be businesses here
we both have to use accountants
milkbar changed accountants about 5 times in 2 years !
lets not mention them again here on this site
what i can tell you is milkbar never went broke, they started a business from a totally unrealistic position
90 % of businesses go broke in the first two years
milkbar falls into that pot
i control the building now i know the sums and electric avenue moved in because i invited phil in to offset my rent .
if his business does not run pretty much fulltime or my business does run pretty much full time there would not be businesses here
we both have to use accountants
milkbar changed accountants about 5 times in 2 years !
lets not mention them again here on this site
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by SNJ Studio » Fri Oct 20, 2006 5:07 pm
Thanks for your advice, everyone. Astrovic, thank you especially this is great info and I understand what you're saying; I have bought and sold quite a bit of gear over the past 8 years and have been trying to keep some kind of capital gains, I even have some assets that have just fried and have been chucked in the tip. All my paperwork thusfar has been on paper so I am going to invest in some accounting software, get everything as organised as possible and shop around for an acountant. That advice on Oct 31 makes it a bit more urgernt, cheers for the heads up!
"if his business does not run pretty much fulltime or my business does run pretty much full time there would not be businesses here"
I hear that, this is the running model of my setup. If I have a quiet month it is another 6 months of catchup. Always balancing between working too hard and praying the phone will ring. I have made it 8 years so far so I guess I made the 2 year hump, I thought MilkBar was around longer than that?
I had never heard anything about Sony winding down, wow. I have only been there a few times as an assistant but my god what a live room setup, stuff of dreams.
Linear, I remember the buzz in the early 90's was the big studio model is dead and gone. There are still amazing facilities being built, but not really in Australia. Several years ago when Fox Studios opened the next driving force for big rooms in Australia seemed to be film work. I heard that this was the main reason Tom Misner built the massive room for 301 at Alexandria - to deal with orchestral tracking dates for major film projects. If Hollywood was filming here let's do the post too. I think this keeps the big studio model alive, but certainly "rock n roll" is not the main artery. But if these rooms are gearing up for 7.1 surround and rooms to record orchestra's, what happens when the pub-rock-band needs a session? They are paying for a studio that has way too many frills for their needs, hence the opportunity for mid-level facilities that offer equal quality in production services, but have trimmed the fat on non essentials.
"In order to keep providing the above which it sounds like your studio is on about, you probably also have to find one or two other sources of cash flow for your studio. A regular quarterly project that brings in a few grand a time can really help."
Should I take my own advice, adapt my studio to cater for other income? I'd love to, but as you say if you become known for "The Good Guys" jingle then maybe your stret cred for underground bands could be somewhat diminished. I try to do free work for local councils putting on band comps and such to get exposed to the new breed of bands, do compilation CD's of the finalists and stuff. I also try and do some live sound for bands who I have engineered in the studio when doing "CD Launch" gigs or big shows. Whenever I stray from actually working with musicians I start to feel like a lab coat technician.... but it is something I am going to have to explore in order to get to the next level in business and life in general. I mean, there are other things in life I need to start dealing with like buying a house, going overseas, all the usual stuff I should be preparing for but cannot fathom how to make it reality with the studio such a harsh mistress.
"Concentrate on your own thing and be thankful that you're doing something you enjoy." When the studio is busy, I've got good bands tracking and stuff I am working on is getting a good response from other engineers and music lovers, I am on fire. It is the best, and I cannot think of a better way to be, feels like this is the path to take. One week of that feeling will get me through a month of crashing computers and final notices.
As I said my comments are not researched, I'm just bouncing around what I hear in studio land. I actually thought I read about the Hillsong purchase of Mangrove in Audio Tech Odd Spot...? Anyway you might think I am narrow minded but I personally feel Christianity could be accused of narrow mindedness for a few of it's "wacky" views. I go to the church of Bill Hicks so I'll leave it at that.
"if his business does not run pretty much fulltime or my business does run pretty much full time there would not be businesses here"
I hear that, this is the running model of my setup. If I have a quiet month it is another 6 months of catchup. Always balancing between working too hard and praying the phone will ring. I have made it 8 years so far so I guess I made the 2 year hump, I thought MilkBar was around longer than that?
I had never heard anything about Sony winding down, wow. I have only been there a few times as an assistant but my god what a live room setup, stuff of dreams.
Linear, I remember the buzz in the early 90's was the big studio model is dead and gone. There are still amazing facilities being built, but not really in Australia. Several years ago when Fox Studios opened the next driving force for big rooms in Australia seemed to be film work. I heard that this was the main reason Tom Misner built the massive room for 301 at Alexandria - to deal with orchestral tracking dates for major film projects. If Hollywood was filming here let's do the post too. I think this keeps the big studio model alive, but certainly "rock n roll" is not the main artery. But if these rooms are gearing up for 7.1 surround and rooms to record orchestra's, what happens when the pub-rock-band needs a session? They are paying for a studio that has way too many frills for their needs, hence the opportunity for mid-level facilities that offer equal quality in production services, but have trimmed the fat on non essentials.
"In order to keep providing the above which it sounds like your studio is on about, you probably also have to find one or two other sources of cash flow for your studio. A regular quarterly project that brings in a few grand a time can really help."
Should I take my own advice, adapt my studio to cater for other income? I'd love to, but as you say if you become known for "The Good Guys" jingle then maybe your stret cred for underground bands could be somewhat diminished. I try to do free work for local councils putting on band comps and such to get exposed to the new breed of bands, do compilation CD's of the finalists and stuff. I also try and do some live sound for bands who I have engineered in the studio when doing "CD Launch" gigs or big shows. Whenever I stray from actually working with musicians I start to feel like a lab coat technician.... but it is something I am going to have to explore in order to get to the next level in business and life in general. I mean, there are other things in life I need to start dealing with like buying a house, going overseas, all the usual stuff I should be preparing for but cannot fathom how to make it reality with the studio such a harsh mistress.
"Concentrate on your own thing and be thankful that you're doing something you enjoy." When the studio is busy, I've got good bands tracking and stuff I am working on is getting a good response from other engineers and music lovers, I am on fire. It is the best, and I cannot think of a better way to be, feels like this is the path to take. One week of that feeling will get me through a month of crashing computers and final notices.
As I said my comments are not researched, I'm just bouncing around what I hear in studio land. I actually thought I read about the Hillsong purchase of Mangrove in Audio Tech Odd Spot...? Anyway you might think I am narrow minded but I personally feel Christianity could be accused of narrow mindedness for a few of it's "wacky" views. I go to the church of Bill Hicks so I'll leave it at that.
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by astrovic » Fri Oct 20, 2006 6:24 pm
No probs SNJ - happy to help
While I was writing that post I was wondering whether you operate through a company or trust structure (I don't think that changes anything much) and realised I have one company and one trust that I set up on 27 June this year. They were dormant until this tax year - 1 July. So I shot a quick email off to my accountant to find out if I still have to file tax returns for them, even though they did nothing in the 4 days of last year.
Of course, the answer was yes :( but at least its simple matter of filing a "didn't do nothing" form rather than the whole shebang. But thanks for indrectly reminding me of this!
The worst thing was, on 27 June I spent $1,600 getting the two company incorporated (ASIC's fee @ $800 a pop). On 1 July they cut the fee to $400. Dammit!
While I was writing that post I was wondering whether you operate through a company or trust structure (I don't think that changes anything much) and realised I have one company and one trust that I set up on 27 June this year. They were dormant until this tax year - 1 July. So I shot a quick email off to my accountant to find out if I still have to file tax returns for them, even though they did nothing in the 4 days of last year.
Of course, the answer was yes :( but at least its simple matter of filing a "didn't do nothing" form rather than the whole shebang. But thanks for indrectly reminding me of this!
The worst thing was, on 27 June I spent $1,600 getting the two company incorporated (ASIC's fee @ $800 a pop). On 1 July they cut the fee to $400. Dammit!
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by astrovic » Fri Oct 20, 2006 6:26 pm
rick wrote:90 % of businesses go broke in the first two years
we've been in business here for 1 year, 10 months and 16 days...think I'd better start throwing salt over shoulder, knocking on wood, licking stray cats and wearing my lucky undies... :)
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by Henry » Fri Oct 20, 2006 7:33 pm
[quote="otto ruiter"]"All the Big Studio's have gone under! All of them! Festival, Milk Bar, Paradise, Sony, even 301 went under but was bought out for nix at the 11th hour. "
Festival didn't go broke. Sony was a corporate decision, nothing to do with viability (it made a 6 figure yearly profit). 301 didn't go under either, and SAE paid handsomely for it.[/quote]
Festival lost money and was cut off by PBL(? cant remember) because it wasn't profitable. 301 was about to close and Tom bought it for peanuts, everyone here knows that!! And I guess Sony made so much money they had to close it down? Yeah ok that's 1 that made money!
Festival didn't go broke. Sony was a corporate decision, nothing to do with viability (it made a 6 figure yearly profit). 301 didn't go under either, and SAE paid handsomely for it.[/quote]
Festival lost money and was cut off by PBL(? cant remember) because it wasn't profitable. 301 was about to close and Tom bought it for peanuts, everyone here knows that!! And I guess Sony made so much money they had to close it down? Yeah ok that's 1 that made money!
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by Howard Jones » Fri Oct 20, 2006 8:04 pm
"Festival lost money and was cut off by PBL(? cant remember) because it wasn't profitable. 301 was about to close and Tom bought it for peanuts, everyone here knows that!! And I guess Sony made so much money they had to close it down? Yeah ok that's 1 that made money!"
What's your problem, mate?
And what has this got to do with the subject of this thread? Why don't you start a separate thread for this on-going rant of yours?
What's your problem, mate?
And what has this got to do with the subject of this thread? Why don't you start a separate thread for this on-going rant of yours?
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by Henry » Fri Oct 20, 2006 8:26 pm
Its not a rant, we're discussing profitabilty or lack of, for Studio's. Big Studio's are clsoing all over the World including Sydney its not news to anyone is it? Smaller Studio's have filled the gap. The market has changed and is changing all the time.
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by Henry » Fri Oct 20, 2006 8:36 pm
[quote="Howard Jones"]"Festival lost money and was cut off by PBL(? cant remember) because it wasn't profitable. 301 was about to close and Tom bought it for peanuts, everyone here knows that!! And I guess Sony made so much money they had to close it down? Yeah ok that's 1 that made money!"
What's your problem, mate?
And what has this got to do with the subject of this thread? Why don't you start a separate thread for this on-going rant of yours?[/quote]
Sorry Howard I was just endorsing what Adam wrote. Have you read it he started the thread? Just read it and your problems solved.
[i]301 wouldn't be here today without SAE, MilkBar is gone and Festival is basically SAE Byron Bay now. I have heard most of the other big studios are getting into massive debt, or have been bought out by non-musical corporations (Mangrove). I chat online to American and European engineers and it seems most have plenty of good paying clients to sustain a career and fit out their setups with new SSL's, that kind of situation seems reserved for quite a small group here in Australia, and most of that group work mostly overseas... Hey this wasn't in my SAE course!!! Feels good to rant. Sorry. Haven't had my "Sophie Monk nipple drying" experience in my studio yet, this thought keeps me goin'. [/i]
What's your problem, mate?
And what has this got to do with the subject of this thread? Why don't you start a separate thread for this on-going rant of yours?[/quote]
Sorry Howard I was just endorsing what Adam wrote. Have you read it he started the thread? Just read it and your problems solved.
[i]301 wouldn't be here today without SAE, MilkBar is gone and Festival is basically SAE Byron Bay now. I have heard most of the other big studios are getting into massive debt, or have been bought out by non-musical corporations (Mangrove). I chat online to American and European engineers and it seems most have plenty of good paying clients to sustain a career and fit out their setups with new SSL's, that kind of situation seems reserved for quite a small group here in Australia, and most of that group work mostly overseas... Hey this wasn't in my SAE course!!! Feels good to rant. Sorry. Haven't had my "Sophie Monk nipple drying" experience in my studio yet, this thought keeps me goin'. [/i]
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by Howard Jones » Fri Oct 20, 2006 9:14 pm
It is a rant - this is a hobbyhorse of yours. Adam runs a studio at the lower end of the market but you have gone out of your way to introduce a sneering tirade about upper end studios. You singularly failed to tie in what you wrote with any point about the topic of the thread.
Do you have any actual point you wish to make?
Do you have any actual point you wish to make?
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by Henry » Sat Oct 21, 2006 12:19 am
Sorry mate, I was just agreeing with what Adam wrote, which was questioned by Kris etc.
Have you read this thread properly? My post pertains to those comments, and are not out of context. What your really saying is you don't agree. Why not just say you don't agree and contradict my post like Otto did?
My point is that, I agree with what Adam wrote, I suggest you read it again properly!
Have you read this thread properly? My post pertains to those comments, and are not out of context. What your really saying is you don't agree. Why not just say you don't agree and contradict my post like Otto did?
My point is that, I agree with what Adam wrote, I suggest you read it again properly!
- Henry
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- Location: Sydney
by SNJ Studio » Sat Oct 21, 2006 4:02 am
Henry, you are on topic thanks for your posts. Maybe I should change the name of this forum subject as the Tax issue has been answered.
Chill, Howard Jones, I love rants. This place was setup by Rick O'Neil after all ;-}
I am very interested in hearing about the trouble of other studios, it feels like I am the only one doing it hard living in my own studio bubble. We are not trying to wallow in others mis-fortune, I just find it very interesting that studios I thought were amazing are folding all the time and it is a reality check when I bitch about paying for an accountant. I did not know Misner got 301 for peanuts, nor did I know about Sony. I'm not hapy about this at all - I used to hire these rooms.
The comments in here about considering one's business strategies and sourcing alternate income is great and something I hate to deal with but have to and if anyone wants to elaborate more on this please post away - if you were a one-man studio that had regular work (band EP's and albums) that financially broke even but not much more, what plan of action would you consider to turn the studio into a profitable asset?
Chill, Howard Jones, I love rants. This place was setup by Rick O'Neil after all ;-}
I am very interested in hearing about the trouble of other studios, it feels like I am the only one doing it hard living in my own studio bubble. We are not trying to wallow in others mis-fortune, I just find it very interesting that studios I thought were amazing are folding all the time and it is a reality check when I bitch about paying for an accountant. I did not know Misner got 301 for peanuts, nor did I know about Sony. I'm not hapy about this at all - I used to hire these rooms.
The comments in here about considering one's business strategies and sourcing alternate income is great and something I hate to deal with but have to and if anyone wants to elaborate more on this please post away - if you were a one-man studio that had regular work (band EP's and albums) that financially broke even but not much more, what plan of action would you consider to turn the studio into a profitable asset?
- SNJ Studio
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- Joined: Thu Oct 19, 2006 5:35 pm
- Location: Sydney
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