guitar cab in a pantry.

[jkhuri44]

gday guys,

im just wondering if i can convert a small storage type pantry with door into a good isolation space to record guitar cabs and bass cabs in.

assume I will treat the insides of this pantry with some sort of insulation, and some professional deadening stuff (which i dont know the brand, or price of yet).

Do you think it is worth while? or because the space is small, will the volumes generated by guitar and bass cabs make the results boxy and crap? (we're talking metal recording hear, so pretty loud volumes inside that small space).

If it is possible at all, ill post some pics up, to see what you guys recommend.

[Jason Dirckze]

Are you thinking about building the space to stop the neighbours complaining?

Or to isolate the mics from external noises? I would've thought that the guitar/bass amps being so loud you wouldnt need to worry about keeping other noise out.

[jkhuri44]

yeh, its about controlling volume...definately the neighbour noise is an issue :P

and also that when recording myself, the sheer volume doesnt intimidate me...

i suppose for quiet clean stuff, noises in the living room and what not would also be an issue.

[Kurt]

Something like this might be easier to achieve a good result with. I think you'll have problems sealing a cupboard tightly enough without lining the whole thing with a layer of heavy mdf or ply (they're usually 12mm chipboard I think)

http://www.amptone.com/diyisobox.htm

[jkhuri44]

well, aint that dandy!

looks like ill have to build something like this. for a 4x12...

that said, the reason i would prefer the pantry though is so i can have
a touch more freedom with micing (i dont mind the difficulty it involves). this method seems to confine you to relatively close micing. with the pantry option, you can get a bit further away, which is sometimes good.. but if all else fails, this is a really cool and cheap option.

Cheers!

[Kris]

Thanks for that. We've been looking for an iso solution to keep stage volumes down as we're switching to in ear monitors later this year. This sort of thing has been talked about so it's good to see how someone else has done it.

[graemeh]

You could use the pantry, but the principles in the Articles about isolation are "sound" ;-) sorry - ie. if air can get out, sound can get out.

The box-within-a-box is best, cushioned on rubber blocks, with the inside damped with heavy duty tontine or similar, and with all internal perimeters caulked with silicone or similar. And the door should have rubber seals and no air leaks, AND the cable entry-exits as well.

16-18mm MDF would be good. Glued and screwed.

Plan on a couple of weekends to do it unless you're a joiner or chippy.
Good luck!

[jkhuri44]

You could use the pantry, but the principles in the Articles about isolation are "sound" ;-) sorry - ie. if air can get out, sound can get out.

that makes sense graemeh..
guess its gonna have to be a big box then...!

[astrovic]

great link Kurt - cheers

[mfdu]

a spot of post-amp attenuation mightn't be a bad thing either - in conjunction with the iso-box. a THD hotplate (or DIY equiv) to bring those 150W heads down to a studio volume.

well, just to put it out there . . .

chris
mfdu

[jkhuri44]

i've heard about those.

and prior to purchasing one I have read very mixed reviews...

some saying that post amp attenuation screws with the quality of the signal....after i heard that i sorta backed away..

i know it sounds bad when you are cranking the attenuation, BUT what are your experiences with it at lower attenuation levels?

[mfdu]

to be honest, my personal heads are a 5W tube and a 20W solid state - they're plenty loud for me, jamming with the missus.

when a client brings a big amp in, i firstly try to determine if the band would sound best if they play together as a band (are they actually aware of each other enough to be able to play as a band?) then i try to balance the volumes in the room.
if i can't do that, i move the amp out (usually into the kitchen, in a box made of cushions and doonas - 'cause i is sooo high-tech, ya'll) - or else i run lines up to the other end of the house and stick guitarist and guitar cab way up there.

if the guitarist insists on running their amp THAT loud, then they can damn well stay in the same room with it and suffer the consequences (nah, i'm not that bad, but sometimes don't ya just want to?)

there's the option reamping as another avoidance technique - track the axe direct, and then reamp through a low-watt amp running at 11 . . . you'd never know.

but i don't have any direct experience with hot plates and such - i just thought i'd throw it out there for your consideration . . .

chris
mfdu

[jkhuri44]

for my needs as such..

i use a mesa boogie amp...
which sounds best...after playing the sh*t out of it for hours...before recording the first note...then cranking the master up to 1 oclock (100W amp = ouchy loud)...so far this has been at my uni studio, where i can sit comfy in the control room, and patch out to the recordin floor, where all the killer dBs of the amp can be on there own.

Now my dilemma is setting up a PT option at home...and wantin that same luxury of blasting my amp....but only turning up my monitors to a comfy jamming volume (hence wanting the pantry or box option)

i have no idea what those kinds of volumes will sound like constricted in a boxed enclosure...

and from what i have heard from people running similar options is that hotplates generally toy with the quality of the sound.

the other thing is, i record metal/experimental...so to me...im not really after a "rocky" sorta sound, i need high gain and clarity at the same time...using a mesa boogie dual recto, and pretty happy with it. If someone invents a 5-10 W 3 channel head....with the tonal options as a dual recto...all i can say is...."one please!"

[Kurt]

You could save up/sell your firstborn to buy the Mesa recording preamp.

for my needs as such..

i use a mesa boogie amp...
which sounds best...after playing the sh*t out of it for hours...before recording the first note...then cranking the master up to 1 oclock (100W amp = ouchy loud)...so far this has been at my uni studio, where i can sit comfy in the control room, and patch out to the recordin floor, where all the killer dBs of the amp can be on there own.

Now my dilemma is setting up a PT option at home...and wantin that same luxury of blasting my amp....but only turning up my monitors to a comfy jamming volume (hence wanting the pantry or box option)

i have no idea what those kinds of volumes will sound like constricted in a boxed enclosure...

and from what i have heard from people running similar options is that hotplates generally toy with the quality of the sound.

the other thing is, i record metal/experimental...so to me...im not really after a "rocky" sorta sound, i need high gain and clarity at the same time...using a mesa boogie dual recto, and pretty happy with it. If someone invents a 5-10 W 3 channel head....with the tonal options as a dual recto...all i can say is...."one please!"

[jkhuri44]

not to sound so very 90's....

but do those things even sound good? to me, cranking a 100W tube amp, and shoving all that signal into a heavy well constructed cab...is part of the sound we look for ....setting up mics to capture the sound of gushing wind from 12 inch speakers...

eh?

[Kurt]

Dunno, can't afford one ;)

not to sound so very 90's....

but do those things even sound good? to me, cranking a 100W tube amp, and shoving all that signal into a heavy well constructed cab...is part of the sound we look for ....setting up mics to capture the sound of gushing wind from 12 inch speakers...

eh?

[jkhuri44]

hahahaha! nice one

adding to what i wrote above...i think the sound of a preamp will be sort of similar to the sound of pluging a guitar clean into a DI....flat...and sort of boring...and the distortion will sound sort of like "flat" and "papery" and balls-less.

but still i shouldnt talk..never heard one....

[mfdu]

i think this link has been posted in the past, but it's relevant again now - http://www.amptone.com/

good info on many aspects of tone - amps, amp iso, amp attenuation, amp micing, but wait, there's more. . .

have a squizz. there might be something in there that solves your problem.

chris
mfdu

[jkhuri44]

we beat you to it Chris!

Kurt posted a link to an iso-box on that site :P

[mfdu]

sorry chaps - i must'a missed it.

please forgive.

chris
mfdu