KM 85??

[TimS]

Just wondering if anyone has used Neumann KM 85's??
I have opportunity to get 2 at the moment but I'm trying to increase my funds for purchasing one of Rob's racked pre's..

Any one using these mic's??
TimS..

[davemc]

Used to have 4 KM85's nice mics. Low end is rolled off so if you happy with that they are nice mics. Not as nice as the KM84 which you can roll off what you want, Although a lot nicer then some Rode's or something. I used them for a lot of things. Depends on price, they used to sell a lot cheaper then now AUD$400-$500 only a few years back.

[rick]

you buy old neumanns whenever you see one you can afford
you save up for old preamps and buy them when you can

[TimS]

A pair just went on EBay for $2000..
See link
Is that over priced for a set of these then??
I would have thought that Neumann held its prices fairly well.
These mics are well over 5yrs old but have not been used in that time.
Prior to that, they were used for recording courtroom proceedings.. so the havent been slammed with reasonably high SPL's..

Ok then, this poses another question for me..

Is it better to have decent mic pre(s) and good mic's or is it better to have a super sounding/really good mic and just ok mic pre's??
Which is the better of both evils? ;-)
I'm thinking the better mic pre's first...

TimS..

[heathen]

I'd say great mics are way more important, a great mic through an ordinary sounding pre will still sound pretty good to great, then if you add a great pre to the equation then you really have the potential to get even better results.

A friend borrowed my fav vocal mic the other night to record a female vocalist, was just the mic straight into his 001 no comp no eq and it sounded superb, then brought the tracks to me to mix, after some basic eq and a little comp the vocals sounded incredible.

An average mic through a great pre will usually still sound pretty average. I was getting crap sounding vocals with a good pre and a shit mic, getting a great mic made all of the difference.

[davemc]

It depends. I think the most important thing now is your playback setup, if you cannot hear correctly you cannot make judgement calls. It depends on what your recording as well if mainly say guitar amps a 57/609/421 sounds a lot nicer into a neve/api style pre then a mackie or a say a u87 into a Mackie for guitars for me. Really all your chain should be great, I find for home recording people get hung up so much on trying to buy gear they do not work on there ears and skills.

[Chris H]

I got two KM85s on eBay last year for $600 each. They are a very nice mic.Full sound without the top end sizzle. They don't sound as tizzy in the top end as a Rode NT5 but still have enough top end..... ( How do you describe sound....) It's softer than an AKG 451. Great for acc guitars mandolin , violin OH kit mics etc. The HPF is in the design of the diaphram and not electronic so its a purer signal path. Great to use to avoid the bottom end accumulation that can build up when multitracking. Most of the time i use em i find myself not needing to eq and they sit in the mix well.

[Howard Jones]

"if you cannot hear correctly you cannot make judgement calls"

Never a truer word spoken. And never more widely ignored than in the last 10 years...

[rick]

great microphones are far more important the pres ( and you know i think pres are important )
but if you not rushing at neves ou can afford the pres can wait there are a zillion out there
good condition neumann microphones on the other hand are much harder to come by
no matter what ebay makes it look like they are rare .
ebay basically shows the collection of all of the worlds 2nd hand neumanns.
gunter can make ANY old neumann behave like new

[heathen]

[quote="rick"]
gunter can make ANY old neumann behave like new[/quote]

Now that is a statement which should not be forgotten, a good deal on a dead mic which can be fixed is still a good deal then I guess, if you know it does'nt work when you purchase it.

[heathen]

[quote="davemc"]It depends. I think the most important thing now is your playback setup, if you cannot hear correctly you cannot make judgement calls. It depends on what your recording as well if mainly say guitar amps a 57/609/421 sounds a lot nicer into a neve/api style pre then a mackie or a say a u87 into a Mackie for guitars for me. Really all your chain should be great, I find for home recording people get hung up so much on trying to buy gear they do not work on there ears and skills.[/quote]

I agree that critical listening is the most important factor and often over rated by some these days and I'd never underestimate the importance of a good pre either, it's just from my experience using my o2r pre's as a benchmark on which I based my statement, they are ok but have no special qualities to them what so ever.

[TimS]

Well, you guys arent making it any easier for me.. hehehe
I'm trying to save up some cash to get one of the Auditronics pre's from Rob - I REALLY thought that a super nice mic pre would be my best bet first.
However, my mate (who's dad owns these KM85's) wants $2G for them.. Having seen ChrisH's post that he got 2 for $600 each, makes me sort of think Hmmm, is it worth it.. I suppose ANY Neumann is worth it though (I can hear Rick saying that..)
Now, I have a few mics already, admittedly they are NOT Neumanns, however, these would be a superb addition to my collection. I WOULD love them. I'm just torn between which is more important first..
I don't have a decent mic pre at the moment hence the interest in Rob's re-racked gear...
I need to choose the better of 2 evils!!

TimS..

[davemc]

Tim, It really depends what your after at the moment. What mics do you have and what do you record? Why the KM85's? I know I had a really good outboard/mic setup before I spent the time on playback setup. So my advice would be to fix that up to be usable now.
The old KRK's I had just lied to much to me in different spots so buying a pair of Questeds made a big difference, then getting the room done correctly again a big diff. Now I am just doing some mixing and stuff from home I just have a little pair of JBL's LSR25's and they are working really well for what I want from them. I know where they are wrong and can mix well on them.
I do not know what the going rate for KM85's are now. Most vintage mics are going way up.

[TimS]

I know these mics are good for acoustic instruments - they are popular for cello's and stringed instruments the like.. they used these mics in the orchestratioon for Lord of the Rings..
I record a fair bit of acoustic guitar at the moment, so I thought these would be a nice supplement to record this type of instrument.
Then again, my mics I have do a decent job too..
I think my mic pre is probably worth getting first.
T..

[Linear]

I have a pair of KM85's. I either use them or Josephson C42's as overheads. The C42's are a little brighter (without being harsh) but the neumanns have the x factor.

Don't be worried about the rolloff, I actually think it's a real advantage. There is a lot of low frequency garbage that flys around when recording a drum kit (even with little suspension clips) so I find them to be ideal. I didn't pay much for mine, but would gladly spend alot more on them again if I had to.

All that said, the Josephsons come very close so if you're hunting around that league of mic, the josephsons will more than competently do the job.

Chris